Dave
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Crowds
Nov 1, 2008 20:35:10 GMT
Post by Dave on Nov 1, 2008 20:35:10 GMT
Meres one would have thought that Bucks would have watched and knew the strengths Of any players before he signed them.
Playing Hargreaves In defense was a mistake and this has been proved by his performance, since being returned to his natural position. We have talked before about playing to players strengths etc, one thing that should always happen, unless you have no choice, Is to play players In the correct positions.
Those Merse are the positions that are natural to them, where they have always played and understand fully the role that position requires. The team now has (except today due to injury) players playing In their best position, only Mansell could be argued Is out Of position,but as we never solved the right back spot and he played there most Of last season, he knows what Is required and has done It long enough to get It right.
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merse
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Crowds
Nov 1, 2008 21:32:08 GMT
Post by merse on Nov 1, 2008 21:32:08 GMT
Meres one would have thought that Bucks would have watched and knew the strengths Of any players before he signed them. We have talked before about playing to players strengths etc, one thing that should always happen, unless you have no choice, Is to play players In the correct positions.  Of course he watched them, but it's only by trying them together one gets a true picture. If players stuck to one position all their careers the -Charlton Bros are a fine example of this, we would have been denied a host of revelations. Jack Charlton was a mediocre right back before he became a World Cup winning central defender. Brother Bobby was a winger before he became a centre forward and then as his pace diminished, a midfielder. The great John Charles made the switch from centre half to centre forward, even our own Colin Lee was a right back when he arrived at Plainmoor from Bristol City. Coach John Rudge tried him up front on the training pitch and Mike Green liked what he saw, and the rest is history...............until Colin lost his pace to old age and returned to being a right back once more at Chelsea! When youngsters are coached in today's environment they are shown different roles within the team pattern (positions) so that at Arsenal my Anthony even gets to experience life as a goalkeeper giving him insight to the type of approach football that makes life difficult for the opposition strikers, and what is easier for them. We all used to marvel at the Dutch Total Football of thirty years ago with players interchanging positions at will and at ease on the ball wherever they are...................this is how it is achieved and whilst Bucks doesn't have players who were ingrained in that method from the age of nine, he has made efforts to develop a few of them as more all round players which then gives him a whole new number of strings to his bow as a coach. Would YOU back anyone else's squad against his at the moment in this league? |
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 5:31:16 GMT
Post by daveshaw on Nov 2, 2008 5:31:16 GMT
Merse you do make me laugh. You attack with the "your sort" "your ilk" jibes because some of us actually dare to think you talk bollox most of the time. I'm sorry we don't follow the party line and spout the gospel according to you. But you see, we are independent thinkers with views of our own. If you could take your head out of Buckles butt for a minute you might be more objective.
I'm delighted with the recent run of results. A good job done by all. But that's what he gets paid for. So i believe the pressure is on him even more now to maintain this run. Of course we are going to lose at some point, but i won't jump on him for that, it's inevitable. What i will be nervous of tho is if he starts losing the plot again and blows all the hard work. However, it's all about results and he's getting them.
As for the drop in crowds. I think it's down to the disappointment of last season added to the shite start to this (Buckles fault for both). Chuck in the credit crunch and it's gotta hurt. I blame Buckle for a good chunk of the drop in atts due to his decisions and failures last and this season. He lost the momentum and good will of the fans by playing poor football and blowing it big time. It's going to be difficult to bring them back. The unusually large drop in atts cannot be put solely down to the crunch. Other teams haven't had the same drop in any league. It's the Buckle factor that made it worse.
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merse
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 10:19:59 GMT
Post by merse on Nov 2, 2008 10:19:59 GMT
Merse you do make me laugh. You attack with the "your sort" "your ilk" jibes because some of us actually dare to think you talk bollox most of the time. As for the drop in crowds. I think it's down to the disappointment of last season added to the shite start to this ( Buckles fault for both). Other teams haven't had the same drop in any league. It's the Buckle factor that made it worse. as in you and the turd you passed when the team won again yesterday? Shite start to a whole season? Tell that to the marathon runners that aren't at the front after a couple of miles next time one passes you. It's also the " Buckle Factor" that has taken us to second place and 11(ELEVEN) games unbeaten! |
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steve
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 10:54:11 GMT
Post by steve on Nov 2, 2008 10:54:11 GMT
Feel it only fair to inform,
The decision to go "back to basics" i.e. play defenders in defence and midfielders in midfield was a decision not of Mr. Buckles making.
Rather imposed on him that one.
Suffice to say, we all benefited.
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 12:16:24 GMT
Post by northyorkshiregull on Nov 2, 2008 12:16:24 GMT
are you saying buckle isnt picking the team?
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Deleted
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 12:41:48 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2008 12:41:48 GMT
i think steve is saying that buckle was told to go back to playing players in their correct position. he must be picking the team and i don't think we would have been happy if someone was telling him what to do, so i think it was not the case.
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 13:32:59 GMT
Post by bitemebryn on Nov 2, 2008 13:32:59 GMT
As for the drop in crowds. I think it's down to the disappointment of last season added to the shite start to this (Buckles fault for both). Chuck in the credit crunch and it's gotta hurt. I blame Buckle for a good chunk of the drop in atts due to his decisions and failures last and this season. He lost the momentum and good will of the fans by playing poor football and blowing it big time. It's going to be difficult to bring them back. The unusually large drop in atts cannot be put solely down to the crunch. Other teams haven't had the same drop in any league. It's the Buckle factor that made it worse. Head..hit..Nail The amount of people still reeling from the disappointment of last season together with the dross served up at the start of this will take some getting over. I don't expect crowds to pick up to what they should be until the Christmas period now. It's a shame but I think people won't part with their cash again until we hit mid season and are looking good still. The credit crunch is a good excuse, but that really is all it is, an excuse. |
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 13:47:40 GMT
Post by ohtobeatplainmoor on Nov 2, 2008 13:47:40 GMT
I think BMB is absolutely correct in his outlook on the attendances. It is a real shame that this is the case, but it has been shown in history to be inevitable - a run of several bad results can take several months of good ones to get the "floating fans" back in Plainmoor.
I can only hope that over the coming months these crowds return to the levels that performances of late really do merit.
Even back in the "promotion season that didn't end in promotion" of 97/98, we were getting dreadful crowds at times. Exactly 11 years ago to the week, we got under 1,500 to watch us beat Darlington on a Tuesday night - but the crowds around the same time of the season were struggling to get over the 2,000 mark on a regular basis (even on a Saturday).
We played just before Christmas against notts County (who were romping the division) and got around 2,500 - and they brought-down about 600 that day!
Perhaps there is something in the psyche of many non-hardcore (and this is not meant in anyway to be a critisism) that they like to see how we are going into the new year before they bother coming along to Plainmoor?
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Dave
TFF member
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 13:59:35 GMT
Post by Dave on Nov 2, 2008 13:59:35 GMT
ohtobeatplainmoor, It has always been my view that football for so many has been just a habit.
Sure there will always be die hards who will support the team from a boy, until they put on the coffin lid.Some will start as new fans and may do the whole season and get hooked, while for others, It may just take a few poor games, before they look elsewhere for their entertainment.
The big problem Is and always will be, those who have gone for years, but got to a point where they simply had enough. When these people break the habit and find other things to do On a Saturday afternoon, It may take something special to happen, to get them back going to games.
Your are correct that some will wait until after Xmas, but that would be for two reasons. One Is as you say they may want to wait to see how we are doing by the time the new year comes.
Two, others may just want to get all the expense Of Xmas put Of the way and look to see how healthy their finances look.
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 14:13:14 GMT
Post by capitalgull on Nov 2, 2008 14:13:14 GMT
I know the figures look bad, and they are, but we haven't exactly been 'lucky' with our home fixtures this season with regards to away 'support' either.
Only Oxford have really brought a support worth the name, and their normal figures for travelling fans were way down because the game was on Setanta on a Thursday. Similar comment applies to York, and of the remaining fixtures we have had, none of the teams has a large away support.
We lost two of the biggest away supports from last season in Exeter and Aldershot and have yet to play Wrexham or Cambridge, but sadly away groups seem to be far lower in the BSP in general, and can be extremely so as the 14 Lewes fans who went to Wrexham yesterday would probably testify.
Ebbsfleet, Woking, Salisbury, Northwich, Eastbourne, Stevenage Mansfield and Chipstead - all either small teams with no away following or bigger teams who tend not to travel as far as they would need to to come to Plainmoor.
So sadly it's not only the credit crunch in Torquay we have to count when it comes to crowd figures. Maybe if this unbeaten run ever reaches 20 games, we'll be getting back up towards the 3,000 mark when all the fickle ones come back to boo on demand.
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Dave
TFF member
Posts: 13,081
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 14:30:00 GMT
Post by Dave on Nov 2, 2008 14:30:00 GMT
Very good points about the lack Of away fans Andy and not only does It affect the gate, but the whole atmosphere.One would hope that Wrexham will fill our away end and more, but this Is just another reason, why Plainmoor lacks something these days.
I'm sure someone will have some figures somewhere, but I wonder If we take more fans over a season to away games, than any other club In the BSP.I do believe that this season, even our away fans numbers have dropped, but not many teams have come to Plainmoor this season with over 100 fans.
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 14:32:30 GMT
Post by capitalgull on Nov 2, 2008 14:32:30 GMT
I would imagine the BSP away crowds list runs something like Wrexham, Oxford, Cambridge, York, Torquay, Mansfield and the rest probably headed by Barrow who seem to take plenty.
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 15:20:30 GMT
Post by daveshaw on Nov 2, 2008 15:20:30 GMT
Merse, bless you mate. You believe what you're told to, you can be lead sheep. As for the rest of us we'll debate with a free mind. Guess what, we can get it wrong, have a heated debate and still end up sharing a beer. Most of us are capable of having our minds changed by logical argument. At the moment i don't believe Buckle is up to it, BUT i will be absolutely thrilled and humbled to be proved wrong.
London cabbies arn't exactly famous for their reasoning skills, but i'll cut you some slack.
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merse
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Crowds
Nov 2, 2008 18:51:37 GMT
Post by merse on Nov 2, 2008 18:51:37 GMT
I would hardly think underlining the achievements of a manager who's team goes eleven games unbeaten whilst winning nine of them amounts to being a sheep. You and your rapidly diminishing little gaggle of chipped shouldered critics are penned in by your ridiculous bitterness that seems to prevent you enjoying such a marvelous run. One would have thought with all the protracted disappointment we have had to put up with over the years such a sad little bunch of gurning flat caps chuntering away in the corner of the pub would grab the opportunity of actually smiling at our current good time. You sit there on the other side of the world begrudging a young manager even a minimum of credit and choose instead to constantly criticise the short period of bedding in that his squad obviously needed at the start of the season. That wasn't management "ineptitude" as you so arrogantly call it (have you ever coached/managed/trained any sort of team?) it was just part and parcel of being manager at any club or any team at any sport. So despite the bleedin' obvious that this is indeed a very good squad, producing a very good product and outstanding results; you choose to wallow in your own misery you sad, sad little man. Bye the way, it's news to me that I am a "London Cabbie", but there we are you do like to put your own slant on things. 
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