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Post by kingpin on Feb 9, 2010 16:13:11 GMT
the things that gets me is how everyone is happy due to the pace we have in the team now but what has this gained us,people say they dont want nico to do his long throws and his long balls but that is what buckle asked him to do,u dont see the stoke fans getting fed up of delap and his throw ins,the fact is while nico was classed as a weak link by many he also took plenty of pressure of the team/defence with his throws and constant excellent crosses.when he was asked to play it on the ground he did exactly that.people say what legends hargreaves and sills r but never mention nico.as has just been put if it wasnt for nico we wouldnt have been in the play offs and then we certainly wouldnt have got promoted last year.i just feel he doesnt get reconised for his loyalty and hard work just because he doesnt fly into tackles or score goals.
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Dave
TFF member
Posts: 13,081
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Post by Dave on Feb 9, 2010 18:06:29 GMT
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Dave
TFF member
Posts: 13,081
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Post by Dave on Feb 9, 2010 18:43:52 GMT
Kingpin I will remove your last post as this is the third time you have posted the exact same post.
Nico has been a great player for our club and I have maintained he still could do a good job for us as there is no one better at long throw-ins, free kicks and corners.
Its clear he no longer fits into Buckles plans and should he be off this week as it is being reported then I wish him the best of luck wherever he goes and I'm sure he will do a first class job for his new club.
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Post by petergodfrey on Feb 9, 2010 20:06:13 GMT
Have to say I agree with Kingpin - Nico was doing fine, as was the team, at the time he got dropped/injured/suspended/rested - I can't remember now !
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merse
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Post by merse on Feb 9, 2010 20:36:25 GMT
Have to say I agree with Kingpin - Nico was doing fine, as was the team, at the time he got dropped/injured/suspended/rested - I can't remember now ! I couldn't disagree more Pete! It was obvious last season that his lack of pace was the only reason he dropped into non league at such a young age given his pedigree of Sheffield Wednesday and Notts County and that once back in the League he would be horribly exposed from a defensive point of view; and this certainly showed itself from the very start of this season. Unfortunately comparisions with Bobby Moore are rather fatuous when comparing one of the world's greatest ever central defenders with a journeyman lower league professional. Even the two positions they play bare no comparison....................Moore like many central defenders of class could overcome that lack of pace with incredible foresight and reading of the game whilst a fullback will always be exposed by a direct challenge of pace that is greater than his. Moore's finest hour in my opinion came in the epic game with Brazil in Mexico in the 1970 World Cup when he was so masterful he could have still managed the pace of Rivelinho and Jair whislt sitting in an armchair, he was that good! If we still want the ball thrown into the opposition penalty area we have Robertson and Nicho's crossing whilst very good is no better than Thomson's. Time to move on with players who CAN cope with this level of football.
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Post by longeatongull on Feb 9, 2010 20:56:16 GMT
Have to say I agree with Kingpin - Nico was doing fine, as was the team, at the time he got dropped/injured/suspended/rested - I can't remember now ! I couldn't disagree more Pete! It was obvious last season that his lack of pace was the only reason he dropped into non league at such a young age given his pedigree of Sheffield Wednesday and Notts County and that once back in the League he would be horribly exposed from a defensive point of view; and this certainly showed itself from the very start of this season. Unfortunately comparisions with Bobby Moore are rather fatuous when comparing one of the world's greatest ever central defenders with a journeyman lower league professional. Even the two positions they play bare no comparison....................Moore like many central defenders of class could overcome that lack of pace with incredible foresight and reading of the game whilst a fullback will always be exposed by a direct challenge of pace that is greater than his. Moore's finest hour in my opinion came in the epic game with Brazil in Mexico in the 1970 World Cup when he was so masterful he could have still managed the pace of Rivelinho and Jair whislt sitting in an armchair, he was that good! If we still want the ball thrown into the opposition penalty area we have Robertson and Nicho's crossing whilst very good is no better than Thomson's. Time to move on with players who CAN cope with this level of football. I think Pete may have hit the nail on the head---having seen Nico at Burton and Notts (both away) this season. On both occasions he was part of two fantastic performances (especially the second half at County). Personally just feel his throws and crosses make up for any loss in pace and he could be accomodated in the team
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Post by stuartB on Feb 9, 2010 20:56:41 GMT
Have to say I agree with Kingpin - Nico was doing fine, as was the team, at the time he got dropped/injured/suspended/rested - I can't remember now ! I couldn't disagree more Pete! It was obvious last season that his lack of pace was the only reason he dropped into non league at such a young age given his pedigree of Sheffield Wednesday and Notts County and that once back in the League he would be horribly exposed from a defensive point of view; and this certainly showed itself from the very start of this season. Unfortunately comparisions with Bobby Moore are rather fatuous when comparing one of the world's greatest ever central defenders with a journeyman lower league professional. Even the two positions they play bare no comparison....................Moore like many central defenders of class could overcome that lack of pace with incredible foresight and reading of the game whilst a fullback will always be exposed by a direct challenge of pace that is greater than his. Moore's finest hour in my opinion came in the epic game with Brazil in Mexico in the 1970 World Cup when he was so masterful he could have still managed the pace of Rivelinho and Jair whislt sitting in an armchair, he was that good! If we still want the ball thrown into the opposition penalty area we have Robertson and Nicho's crossing whilst very good is no better than Thomson's. Time to move on with players who CAN cope with this level of football. How people change their opinions, eh! the first year I thought Nico was brilliant and every set piece was on the money for Sills. Corners, free kicks, crosses etc all spot on. Several on here even moaned at that, as we only created goals from set pieces. Last season Nico showed a vulnerability in defence mainly due to his lack of pace. we could forgive him the previous season because he created so much BUT even his creativity deserted him. I remember thinking at the time, why his accuracy had deserted him. his corners didn't hit the mark, free kicks wasted and crosses not beating the first man. i put it down to his confidence because, even back then, Buckle seemed determined to replace him by bringing in Hodges at the start of the season. Hodges obviously did not work out but it took Nico a large part of the season to regain his confidence. this season Smith is head and shoulders, in all departments to Nico. cox has the same defensive weaknesses but has potential to improve because he is young. Sorry but it's thanks Nico for 2 great years and good luck in the Conference
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Post by petergodfrey on Feb 9, 2010 22:06:38 GMT
Sure, Smith is great, I'm a big fan. Most would probably agree he's better at RB. Admittedly I haven't been able to see many games but Notts was one of them and Nico was good. He surprised me by winning a good deal in the air too. At the end of the day it's down to results and they were ok with Nico. From reports it seems he did get skinned sometomes and I have to accept i didn't see those matches. What we seem to be short of is genuine options, such as Sills and CH would have given us, even tho waiting for replacements for them. I have stuck up for Benyon, but, having just seen the miss at Hereford I have to say most posters have been over-kind to him; it looked like a bad miss to me and I'm sure Sills would have been in the right place and buried it !
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Post by wrangatongulls on Feb 9, 2010 22:39:17 GMT
just for the record the best part of the season so far result wise, was december and guess what ?nico hardly got on the pitch, granted the opposition may of been weaker but four clean sheets non the less !
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Post by kingpin on Feb 10, 2010 1:20:24 GMT
and the worst part of the season so far? Yep thats right nico wasnt in it so thats a poor fact.
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Post by aussie on Feb 10, 2010 10:48:00 GMT
you know darn well that bobby moore didn/t play wing back! just as vulnerable in the centre of defence , but reading of the game and positional play made him the arguably best defender in the world,despite lack of pace. young fast defenders who have pace but no experience is not the answer and never will be. So how can you justify the comparison of two players that play in different positions or are you some sort of football genius? Wing backs are generally faster than centre backs, now I wonder why that might be, am being sarcky enough? You can have a fast wing back cover the slower centre backs arris but you can`t have a fast centre back cover a slow wing back with opening massive defensive gaps in middle of the park, it`s glaringly bleedin` obvious!!!!!!!
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Post by phipsy on Feb 10, 2010 13:49:45 GMT
BACK TO KEVIN NICHOLSON.I HAVE WATCHED THE GULLS PLAY FOR OVER 55 YEARS AND WOULD INCLUDE NICO ASONE OF THE BEST LEFT SIDED BACKS, WING BACKS OR WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL HIM WITH AMONG THE BEST. THESE WOULD INCLUDE BILL KITCHENER,PHIL SANDERCOCK,COLIN ANDERSON,BRIAN MGLINCHY AND PHIL KING. NO I DONT CONSIDER MYSELF A FOOTBALL GENIOUS BUT NOT A COMPLETE MUG EITHER AS MY F.A. COACHING BADGES WOULD PROVE.
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Post by aussie on Feb 10, 2010 14:05:15 GMT
Is using capitals your way of shouting? I have said in the past if Nicho had any pace he wouldn`t have signed for us because he would be playing at a much higher level and we would not have been able to afford him, he has some very good attributes but lacks any pace what so ever thus he`s plying his trade at the level he can play at, the foot of league 2 or the Conference no higher, I`m sorry if plain and blatant facts upset you but that`s just the way it is!! Look where he came from, big clubs liked the look of him and spotted definate ability but then let him go, why, ask yourself the question why did they let him go and what direction did he go in? As far as badges go, which ones and how long ago because I made it to semi-pro as a player but hardly any of what I learned back then is used or appropriate in this modern game, maybe the basic principles are the same but technique and formation plus various other factors such as diet and training have all changed radically over the years! Having old qualifications is about as useful as playing Championship Manager on the Xbox, useless!
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Post by aussie on Feb 10, 2010 14:06:43 GMT
Who`s the bloke in the first photo that appears to be doing an impersonation of the Karate Kid? Mantis style!
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Post by jmgull on Feb 10, 2010 14:26:46 GMT
I, too am firmly in the Nicho camp.
I take on board the lack of pace etc. but he gave us another dimension to our attacking play, the throw ins we haven't missed much i'll agree but a left foot as good as that is a rarity at our level, i would still have him in the side now and would have given him a contract for next season, him at Left Back and Smith at Right back would make us a much stronger side currently. The way he can whip a ball in at pace is a huge, huge asset in my opinion and extremely hard to defend against, we have no one else on the books that comes close to having Nicholsons crossing ability or his expertise from dead ball situations.
With work on his positional play, which isn't that bad anyway to be fair.....and a bit of cover from the Left midfielder, he would be in my team every week. I agreed with likes of Todd, Greavsie and (reluctantly) Sills being shown the door.....as i believe we can replace with better. Smith is wasted at LB and on his wrong side, Cox is not even nearly ready from the Hereford showing and Charnock is a CB.
As Phipsy said, pace is important but it's not everything!
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