Dave
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Post by Dave on Jan 7, 2009 15:55:42 GMT
As would be expected the price for the 4th round FA cup game against Coventry has been increased by one pound, to cover the police costs etc. I'm sure we understand that the costs are forced onto the club and therefore onto the fans, to help maintain a good income for the club.
All it says on .com about the ticket arrangements, it that the away standing area and the grandstand will be all ticket. I find this a bit strange and wonder if it is the best move.If the game had been all ticket the club could have issued vouchers at the next game and even the Wrexham game. This would have helped increase the gates for those two games.
One problem that might happen and does concern me, is if Coventry sell all their tickets and their fans without tickets come down and just pay and come in the popside. While I do not think their fans have any history of trouble, I would still prefer to see home terraces full of only home fans.
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merse
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Post by merse on Jan 7, 2009 16:23:27 GMT
I think the club have got it exactly right on this one, "All Ticket" needs to be avoided at almost all costs. I think the SkyBlues will do well to sell out their allocation anyway and the Torbay public are hardly flocking in this season are they? Saturday's gate was very poor considering it was the Third Round of the FA Cup - almost a thousand less than Forest Green Rovers produced. Even if there did happen to be a small number of Coventry fans on the day, I see know reason why (with proper stewarding and policing) they could not be safely and adequately accommodated near the neutral corner of the Away End and the Popside; after all football clubs should be in the business of accommodating people NOT turning them away. There was room for another two and a half thousand in the ground last Saturday remember, and it will take some doing to fill those spaces up.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Jan 7, 2009 16:49:26 GMT
I would be surprised if a team in the Championship, playing in a forth round FA cup could not sell, what will be around 1500 tickets. I'm sure if the game was at their ground and TUFC were offered only 1500 tickets, that we would sell them all.
We have covered all the reasons why the gates have been lower this season, but one more reason is the amount of home games that have been played lately, many just can't afford to be going nearly every week, like it has been recently.
No one can say how much extra interest this game will get, no one can say how many fans who have not been to other games, will want to go to this game. Barnet made a big mistake not making one game all ticket and look what happened, so many fans missed the game, as the ground was full up.
I also remember a home game a few seasons ago, when we had our own fans unable to get into the ground(sure someone will let us know what game it was) yet the ground had away fans in all the stands at our ground. It Coventry sell all their tickets and a few hundred came without tickets and all went on the popside, it would only need a few hundred extra of our own fans deciding this was a game they wanted to attend, that we could see those who come just before kick- off not getting into the ground.
I for one do not want to stand on a home terrace and have a group of away fans standing nearby, its fine to say it would be OK, if the stewards did their jobs properly, but do we really have that much faith in them. We saw how things were handled at a game not so long ago.
The point is football is a very passionate sport, it only takes one bad tackle out on the pitch, a goal, or even a red card to get some fans really wound up. It can even happen when home fans shout out some abuse to a player from the other side, why run the risk of having problems in the ground, by allowing away fans to mix on home terraces.
I would hope that the game would be trouble free, If there were no concerns at all that it would be, there would be no need to even have any police would there. All games of this nature carry the risk of some problems, I just want to go and watch the game and feel safe in an area that I as a home fan I should be able too. Yes the club must try and maximize the income, but it also has a duty to make the ground as safe as possible for its fans.
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Post by capitalgull on Jan 7, 2009 17:25:07 GMT
Current estimations from a Coventry fan I know are that tickets WILL sell out within 48 hours of them going on sale. Their history in the Cup (Keith Houchen and all that) apparently means that the Cup is a big thing for Sky Blues fans, and the addition of a trip to the bracing seaside seems to have some of them excited.
Indeed, viewing .net, a few Covvy fans have been on asking how easy it will be for them to get tickets in the home parts of the ground.
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Post by pikeygull on Jan 7, 2009 18:26:30 GMT
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Post by aussie on Jan 7, 2009 18:27:55 GMT
Forgotten Oxford already have we, great that means I can`t take my daughter because the risk is too high, all ticket the whole ground for christ sake, what if Covv have a couple of louts that actually have testicles, we were lucky the Poxford fans were ball-less little scroats, seen the latest news about Covv fans rioting only a match or two ago!!
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Post by stuartB on Jan 7, 2009 21:06:04 GMT
I'll be going to Rushden game on Saturday but not coventry game. If anyone needs my voucher, please let me know
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Jan 7, 2009 22:01:59 GMT
Well after Merse saying that the club had made the correct decision, I'm sure for once he will now be able to say they have made a wrong one. But they have done the correct and proper thing in my book and I'll tell you why. The days of Batson are long past, he would have not cared about any risks or concerns, he would have only looked at what money he could get through the gate. Our board has realized that Coventry will sell their tickets and as a result many will travel without tickets and get onto home terraces. No club should do anything that could put their own fans at risk and no matter what Merse thinks, having away fans mixed in with home fans has the potential for problems and even trouble.The club has made good money already in the FA cup, more than they might have expected, plus they may now get even more unexpected money from the Ward sell on clause, there is no need for greed. While it may make the gate a bit smaller, we could see a few extra on Saturday now and it could just all even out in the end. So a big well done TUFC, for thinking about it and making the correct decision, I for one will feel a lot better knowing that the only people on the popside should now be only TUFC fans.
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jerry
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Post by jerry on Jan 7, 2009 22:20:21 GMT
Think it was Northampton I last saw that for (ie: division on the Pop) and whilst they were a whisker away from automatic promotion I seem to remember we were mathematically able to get a play-off spot that day before Jamie Forrester did his worst. Yeah I remember that! Nothing worse than watching away fans celebrate promotion at your ground!!
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Post by chrish on Jan 7, 2009 22:38:48 GMT
Think it was Northampton I last saw that for (ie: division on the Pop) and whilst they were a whisker away from automatic promotion I seem to remember we were mathematically able to get a play-off spot that day before Jamie Forrester did his worst. Yeah I remember that! Nothing worse than watching away fans celebrate promotion at your ground!! Yes, well we all had that horrible sinking feeling last season didn't we? As the final whistle blew YorkGull turned to me and said "Come on lets go, I'm not hanging around to watch these knuts celebrate".
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merse
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Post by merse on Jan 8, 2009 3:48:38 GMT
Even if there did happen to be a small number of Coventry fans on the day, I see know reason why ( with proper stewarding and policing) they could not be safely and adequately accommodated near the neutral corner of the Away End and the Popside; after all football clubs should be in the business of accommodating people NOT turning them away. That is clearly NOT saying "have away fans mixed in with home ones" is it Dave? I am disappointed that with the "quote" facility there for use, you embark on a cheap shot misrepresentation of my view by stating that. "All Ticket" does not guarantee exclusively home fans in all but the designated away section as the example of another Midlands visitor, Birmingham City; showed all too well. Torbay is such a well utilised place for holidays and retirement for Midlanders that there will be plenty of Coventry fans with the links and resources to obtain tickets from South Devon sources should they feel the need. After all, the existence of current segregation clearly did not prevent a number of Oxford fans from gaining entry to the Popside recently even when there was adequate room for them in the away section. It's clearly NOT the rules and regulations one has in place that are of the optimum but the quality and intelligence of those charged with applying them in and around the stadium that you want to worry about.
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Post by gandalfgull on Jan 8, 2009 10:36:04 GMT
The Oxford fans that came in where lead by two 'local' Oxford fans and none had the club colours on (although yellow it would have been!). I also agree that there are a lot of Coventry fans living locally who can obtain tickets with a local address. All ticket is the right way in my mind and I think any 'trouble makers' would want to be in with their lot first and foremost.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2009 11:47:00 GMT
Reading this thread - and thinking back to some of the comments after the non-segregated game at Eastbourne - has led to mull over how certain aspects of watching football have changed.
My first away games were at Reading and Argyle in 1968. At Elm Park I recall being with the bulk of the Torquay supporters behind one goal; at Home Park I went with my dad and I think we sat in the Mayflower Stand (we certainly did on Boxing Day 1969). I have a stronger memory of Bournemouth in September 1969. At the ground I met with school friends and we went through the first turnstile we found. This turned out to be the Bournemouth "End" and, when there was trouble, we legged it the length of the pitch to the far end (the "Brighton Beach End" as it was sarcastically known from when it was a stony bank) where the younger Torquay supporters had begun to congregate. What I don't remember is whether there was any formal segregration (I doubt it) and, if not, where the older Torquay supporters - old gits like me now - stood or sat. My guess is they were dotted around the ground. Likewise, I wouldn't be surprised if there were plenty of older Bournemouth supporters stood in their customary places at the Brighton Beach End.
This was an age when, just like we see lower down the pyramid even now, there was still the culture of some supporters changing ends at half-time provided the ground layout allowed it. But this was soon to change with the concept of "The End" being at the heart of much of the trouble inside grounds in the 1970s. I think The End started to become a bigger part of terrace culture in the 1960s. It really meant less "dads and lads" stood together - now you had "dads" in one part of the ground; "lads" in another. And, in the nature of these things, once there was an "End", it was there to be taken (but not by the likes of me you must understand).
In time - during the 1970s I'm guessing - segregation was introduced. I understood why this was needed but, at the same time, I felt edgy because the away section became the focus of attention within grounds. This might mean (and I'm not really talking Torquay here) missiles, abuse, attempts to scale the barriers, tension, heavy-handed policing, police escorts, etc - or - if you went to see Torquay at Rochdale on a Tuesday night - utter loneliness and the possibility of being recognised and accompanied back to the railway station (either by the police or the locals). Consequently, whoever I was watching, I tended to avoid away ends like the plague and quietly watch from the side.
It wasn't until the late 1980s - or even the early 1990s - when I started to watch Torquay away matches from the designated section. This was partly because there was less trouble but also because our away support became healthier. It suddenly became fun to have our own part of a ground. And, with that, I believe even more people started to go to away matches. Personally, now, there are days when I enjoy the craic of the away section - others when I don't - and, if a better view is available to me, I may sometimes opt to take it.
I feel the overall outcome is that most fans are now totally unaccustomed to watching games with opposition supporters. It's simply an alien prospect. It could even be that someone with whom you watch games has brought along a mate who supports them. Or it could be that you go to a smaller ground, where segregation is never an issue, and you feel distinctly uncomfortable as a result. This isn't quite my outlook - I watch lots of games as a neutral and with all sorts of people - but I feel this is the way it has become. Safety is an issue and a concern - of course - but I believe territory and identity are the stronger forces at play in people's minds these days. Being with "your own" is the way most people prefer it, that's how they enjoy it and, let's face it, that's the way it'll always be in the Football League. Equally, we shouldn't expect segregation at ordinary matches much below the BSP. I actually felt okay about the arrangements at Eastbourne - although, as the league changes (Luton Town?), it'll be interesting to see how the BSP will move on this issue in future.
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midlandstufc
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Post by midlandstufc on Jan 8, 2009 12:40:55 GMT
Gonna have to agree with both of Merse's posts here. (ooh, that hurt!)
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Post by buster on Jan 8, 2009 13:29:09 GMT
Merse
Ever considered a career in politics?
"All ticket to be avoided at all costs" tactfully avoided in your response to Dave.
Who said the art of debate was dead.
;D Buster
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