rjdgull
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Post by rjdgull on Sept 25, 2010 8:53:44 GMT
Isn`t there oil near the Falklands? Just like Iraq being next to Q8, the invasion of Iraq was purely not at all down to oil was it? Most of these conflicts are about money (oil, diamonds, land)! Exploratory drilling has just begun but I really don't believe that this was a factor thirty years ago. Most of the advice that Thatcher initially received was that it couldn't be done and to reach a negotiated settlement.
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Post by lambethgull on Sept 25, 2010 9:35:40 GMT
Thatcher may have relished the opportunity given to her by the idiotic Galtieri, but none of the arguments against the sending of the task force stack up in my opinion. No government can just sit there whilst its territory and people are invaded, and whilst Thatcher's cosying up to the likes of Augusto Pinochet show her true colours, the default position of many on the left to oppose ANY military action, no matter what the cause or provocation, really does them no favours whatsoever.
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merse
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Post by merse on Sept 25, 2010 9:43:23 GMT
Rob stated on here earlier that the Falklands War had given this country back it's self respect........................you're a bloody lunatic saying that; what the feck did THAT achieve save divert attention away from a bunch of senile old reactionaries waging class war on their own people? I find that pretty bloody offensive actually, as someone who was heavily involved in the Falkland's war and gave 26 years service to the Queen. I'm not looking for praise or any of that 'thanks' bollocks, as I did so willingly, of my own volition, and got well paid for it in return. Unfortunately my patriotism and wish to serve my country also benefits ungrateful, self-centered, opinionated blokes like you, who take for granted their right to free speech and the security that allows you to sleep easily in your bed. I'm sorry if you were offended by my view "Flo' Rida", but my jibe was aimed at the politicians of BOTH sides and the politics they peddled. It's an old chestnut that political flaws be covered up by diverting public opinion through war mongering. The Argentinian Fascists were at it, as were the British Fascists and as usual "Tommy Atkins" and pals lost their limbs, sight and lives. Thatcher suffered from a mental illness that deluded her into believeing she was the "Female Churchill" At least Churchill had the bollocks to be at Sydney Street himself, as if Thatcher and her buffoons ever had the nerve to go to Orgrieve, or even the Falklands themselves. Year's of service to "The Queen"? her uncle Edward 7th was a Nazi collaborator, had your predecessors lost the Second World War, those feckers would have changed sides at the snap of a finger. Look pal, when you as a professional serviceman go to war you do so with the funding and the political mandate of the people of this country not for the bloody Queen. So if the people turned on the Royalists and the Establishment you would wage war on the public would you? Like the police did in the Trafalgar Square Poll Tax riot that spelt the beginning of the ditching of Mad Thatcher by the scared Tories. Like they did during the Miners' Strike. So people who wear the "Crown" insignia on their uniforms give that precedence over the people of this country eh? This country was NOT in danger of invasion by the Argentinians as it was by the Germans. It was no more interested in the population of those islands than it was in those of the Channel Islands in the Second World War. They were seemed expendable in the greater national interest as YOUR life is by "The Queen" when it suits. I have every respect for every professional military person and conscript too, I do not respect those political opportunists who use them and abuse them. My right to free speech and security has been put in much greater peril by the likes of Thatcher and B Liar and their profile boosting war mongering than any foreign threat such as that posed during REAL wars. Intelligent countries and their electorate who enjoy far higher standards of living than we do, do so because they do not waste large percentages of the national purse of war mongering. You don't see the Scandinavian countries, Holland, France, Germany, Austria, or any other European country pursuing this American Republican arse licking. When modern day Tommy's have to go out and buy their OWN suitable equipment to go and fight Bush and B Liar's war in the Middle East and Afghanistan and still stand stiffly to attention and toast "The Queen", I can only shake my head in disbelief. When I survey all hell and destruction about me in our own capital city through the bitterness and warp mindedness of extremists brought upon us by B Liar's idiotic pandering to the USA, I get rather offended too as it happens. Like I said, I'm sorry YOU got offended, but I find the ludicrous patriotism and faux celebratory mood of triumph surrounding such things as The Falklands Conflict highly offensive.
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Post by aussie on Sept 25, 2010 9:46:54 GMT
Isn`t there oil near the Falklands? Just like Iraq being next to Q8, the invasion of Iraq was purely not at all down to oil was it? Most of these conflicts are about money (oil, diamonds, land)! Exploratory drilling has just begun but I really don't believe that this was a factor thirty years ago. Most of the advice that Thatcher initially received was that it couldn't be done and to reach a negotiated settlement. We watched this unfold in Australia and it was deffo about oil mate, not being funny but when I first came over here I couldn`t believe how filtered the news is over here, you only hear what the government wants you to hear! FACT! Properganda is rife and always has been in this country, take any global news event that involves this country and look at how it is portrayed by the British press and then source some indepentant news coverage from a different neutral country and compare the articles, you be amazed at the difference. Next time your on holiday abroad don`t buy the British news papers abroad buy and read the local news papers and see the difference, I know I`m going to get certain people on here having a go at my anti-British stance but I can assure you I`m just being anti-British, just honest! It`s merely observation, nothing more!
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merse
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Post by merse on Sept 25, 2010 9:52:41 GMT
................when I first came over here I couldn`t believe how filtered the news is over here, you only hear what the government wants you to hear! FACT! Properganda [sic] is rife and always has been in this country, take any global news event that involves this country and look at how it is portrayed by the British press and then source some indepentant news coverage from a different neutral country and compare the articles, you be amazed at the difference. I couldn't agree more Aussie......................even YOUR Aussie ostriches don't bury their heads in the sand as deeply as so many do in THIS country!
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Post by lambethgull on Sept 25, 2010 9:55:12 GMT
Exploratory drilling has just begun but I really don't believe that this was a factor thirty years ago. Most of the advice that Thatcher initially received was that it couldn't be done and to reach a negotiated settlement. We watched this unfold in Australia and it was deffo about oil mate, not being funny but when I first came over here I couldn`t believe how filtered the news is over here, you only hear what the government wants you to hear! FACT! Properganda is rife and always has been in this country, take any global news event that involves this country and look at how it is portrayed by the British press and then source some indepentant news coverage from a different neutral country and compare the articles, you be amazed at the difference. Next time your on holiday abroad don`t buy the British news papers abroad buy and read the local news papers and see the difference, I know I`m going to get certain people on here having a go at my anti-British stance but I can assure you I`m just being anti-British, just honest! It`s merely observation, nothing more! Don't be surprised to read a British perspective in a British newspaper Aussie. I'm sure coverage of the recent Australian elections would have been different in Australia to the way it was covered in Indonesia, New Zealand, Japan or the UK...that's just how things are. It's definately a good idea to consume one's media through as many sources as possible though.
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Post by aussie on Sept 25, 2010 10:41:40 GMT
................when I first came over here I couldn`t believe how filtered the news is over here, you only hear what the government wants you to hear! FACT! Properganda [sic] is rife and always has been in this country, take any global news event that involves this country and look at how it is portrayed by the British press and then source some indepentant news coverage from a different neutral country and compare the articles, you be amazed at the difference. I couldn't agree more Aussie......................even YOUR Aussie ostriches don't bury their heads in the sand as deeply as so many do in THIS country! Emus Merse, their Emus unless you are refering to Ozzy Ostrich from the t.v show Hey Hey I`t`s Saturday!
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Post by aussie on Sept 25, 2010 10:46:00 GMT
We watched this unfold in Australia and it was deffo about oil mate, not being funny but when I first came over here I couldn`t believe how filtered the news is over here, you only hear what the government wants you to hear! FACT! Properganda is rife and always has been in this country, take any global news event that involves this country and look at how it is portrayed by the British press and then source some indepentant news coverage from a different neutral country and compare the articles, you be amazed at the difference. Next time your on holiday abroad don`t buy the British news papers abroad buy and read the local news papers and see the difference, I know I`m going to get certain people on here having a go at my anti-British stance but I can assure you I`m just being anti-British, just honest! It`s merely observation, nothing more! Don't be surprised to read a British perspective in a British newspaper Aussie. I'm sure coverage of the recent Australian elections would have been different in Australia to the way it was covered in Indonesia, New Zealand, Japan or the UK...that's just how things are. It's definately a good idea to consume one's media through as many sources as possible though. I`t`s not a competition or a comparison it`s merely an observation, like I intitialy said, I wasn`t having a go at the British I was just being honest with what I saw! Why do you get so defensive/hostile when ever I make an observation? Do you think I`m always having a go at Britain because if I come across that way I do apologise because it is not meant that way!
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Post by lambethgull on Sept 25, 2010 11:16:04 GMT
Don't be surprised to read a British perspective in a British newspaper Aussie. I'm sure coverage of the recent Australian elections would have been different in Australia to the way it was covered in Indonesia, New Zealand, Japan or the UK...that's just how things are. It's definately a good idea to consume one's media through as many sources as possible though. I`t`s not a competition or a comparison it`s merely an observation, like I intitialy said, I wasn`t having a go at the British I was just being honest with what I saw! Why do you get so defensive/hostile when ever I make an observation? Do you think I`m always having a go at Britain because if I come across that way I do apologise because it is not meant that way! Where's the hostility? I don't think there's any doubt that our newspapers and news media report from a British perspective. I was simply making the observation that something similar occurs in other places too.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2010 14:05:47 GMT
When I joined up, I swore an oath to the Queen; the apolitical head of our state. To go back generations, Mr Merse, and try to besmirch the Queen through her ancestry shows what a shallow little man you are.
I don’t care which politician or party leads the country. Never have. They are democratically elected, which is good enough for me. My only job as a serviceman is to go where the government of the day decides to deploy the army. We go whether we agree with the reason or not. And we do our jobs 100% regardless.
There are many British soldiers who did not agree with the Iraq invasion or the ongoing conflict in Afghanistan. In the Forces’ world though that is an irrelevance and they give a 100% because they are members of a society where one member will literally lay down his life for another. They are all bonded together by that oath, and proud of it. You will never have experienced such camaraderie or loyalty nor had such a sense of belonging.
253 servicemen died in the Falklands, and many more young British servicemen and women have died in conflicts around the world and will continue to do so. Fortunately, their sterling efforts are recognized by the vast majority of the public. My belief in my country is continuously buoyed by the fact that there are still many young men and women that can see that life is not just about the ‘me, me, me’ society, who join the Forces and go on to become outstanding soldiers, sailors and airmen.
May God bless every one of them.
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merse
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Post by merse on Sept 25, 2010 15:04:15 GMT
When I joined up, I swore an oath to the Queen; the apolitical head of our state. To go back generations, Mr Merse, and try to besmirch the Queen through her ancestry shows what a shallow little man you are. Referring to someone's uncle and one through who's personal conduct The Queen owes her present day priveleged postion in society is hardly "going back generations" is it? You bring personal abuse into the argument and call me a "shallow little man" ~ who do you think you are, some buffoon on a drill square peering out at me from under a ridiculously pulled down peaked cap? Edward 7th was threatened with court martial by Winston Churchill ~ FACT . He had to be banished and taken by Naval escort to the Bahamas because he was snivelling in Lisbon with Nazi guards on his properties in Paris ~ FACT. He had been photographed reviewing Nazi troops and giving the Nazi salute whilst guys who had "sworn allegience" to him, as "apolitical" Head of State; laid down their lives. Again, I am not disrespecting serving personel; I am illustrating the dispicable way they are and always have been, treated by the establishment. How did your predecessors in the Second World War feel when Ribbentropp and Hitler were proclaiming Edward as a Nazi sympathiser and someone they would re-instate as Head of State once the invasion was completed? Nothing to do with ancestry, purely FACTS! Why then did the Royal Historian, Owen Morshead; get dispatched to Friedrichshoff in 1945 to retrieve letters sent between Hitler and Edward if not to protect the image of the Royal Family? Letters that were subsequently deposited in the Royal Archives where they remain to this day hidden away from public scrutiny? Why are they still under lock and key, why are they not available to the public to read for themselves?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2010 16:01:49 GMT
You bring personal abuse into the argument and call me a "shallow little man" ~ who do you think you are, some buffoon on a drill square peering out at me from under a ridiculously pulled down peaked cap? No, I don't actually. I do think you may have watched too many military parodies over the years to think that that accurately describes the military. Get over your inferiority complex and post something of interest.
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merse
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Post by merse on Sept 25, 2010 16:13:58 GMT
Get over your inferiority complex and post something of interest. If what I post is of "no interest" why do you respond to it? You're coming over as out of your depth and unable to debate without throwing personal insult about
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merse
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Post by merse on Sept 25, 2010 16:24:39 GMT
In fact Flo' you haven't debated at all. you have failed to answer ONE question I put to you and you have carried on arguing on another obtuse point all together, namely how wonderful the military are; when that has never been called into question. You respond as if the calibre of the military has been sullied as if their diligence towards their duty has been queried................disrespected even. Clearly this is not the point of issue, not from me or anyone else. The point of issue is the conduct of Margaret Thatcher during her premiership and the subsequent conduct of Tony B Liar and his chicanery over the Iraq War. That is the debate, why are you banging on about soldiers?
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merse
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Post by merse on Sept 25, 2010 16:28:10 GMT
Emus Merse, their Emus unless you are refering to Ozzy Ostrich from the t.v show Hey Hey I`t`s Saturday! I bow to your greater knowledge of all things antipodean ~ there was I thinking Ozzy Ostrich was a blue spectacled sufferer of Tourette's Syndrome and head of a disfunctional family! ;D
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