chelstongull
TFF member
Posts: 6,759
Favourite Player: Jason Fowler
|
Post by chelstongull on Sept 17, 2010 17:26:41 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by romfordkev on Sept 17, 2010 17:55:48 GMT
Is this the latest literary offering from JK Rowling? Can't see it being as popular as all those books about a speccy wizard some how!  |
|
merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
|
Post by merse on Sept 17, 2010 18:08:59 GMT
 Careful Phil, you'll scare the children. Altogether now kiddies: "Thatcher, Thatcher ~ Milk snatcher!" 
|
|
|
|
Post by jmgull on Sept 17, 2010 19:42:48 GMT
Maggie....? It's a "yay" from me  |
|
keyberrygull
TFF member
Posts: 994
Favourite Player: Steve Cooper
|
Post by keyberrygull on Sept 17, 2010 23:04:02 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by lambethgull on Sept 18, 2010 6:59:52 GMT
Maggie for me any day but I will probably be sent to Coventry for having an opinion! Closed shop  Who you or anyone else likes, prefers or admires is a matter for you. That surely doesn't mean others can't have or express an opinion on that. (Your little strop and spurned lover routine with Merse btw is getting very boring and tiresome for others to read.) |
|
|
|
Post by stefano on Sept 18, 2010 7:18:13 GMT
Maggie for me any day but I will probably be sent to Coventry for having an opinion! Closed shop Who you or anyone else likes, prefers or admires is a matter for you. That surely doesn't mean others can't have or express an opinion on that. An admirable and very sensible view Lambeth, although if a Trade Unionist tries to express an opinion by not going on strike when others are then his / her family become outcasts in their own community for generations. Strange country really. A land of freedom of speech and thought ... for some!  |
|
rjdgull
TFF member
Admin
Posts: 12,227 
|
Post by rjdgull on Sept 18, 2010 7:32:39 GMT
I suppose Maggie is a bit like Marmite in that you either loved her or hated her. From the perspective of the left she destroyed much of our industry along with the communities in these area , increased employment as well as keeping the left out of power for a generation. Very much a hated figure on the left and fair game for personal abuse and ridicule such as Merse's "tits" comment yesterday.
For the right, we were no longer the sick man of Europe, in thrall to the unions and in debt up to our eye balls. There was pride in the country, particularly after the Falkland's conflict and in the later 80's there was much individual opportunity.
From a regional perspective, the south west was very much Tory, at least in terms of seats. Maggie handsomely won three elections and drew Labour back into the centre ground to win three elections themselves.
From a football perspective, I suppose Buckle is a manager that seems to polarise opinion, although being presently top of the league means everyone is more or less on board and there is very little scope for debate. If he can emulate Maggie and win three promotions (the long term target of the board) then he should have no similar fourth term woes, assuming of course that he is still with us!
|
|
|
|
Post by lambethgull on Sept 18, 2010 7:36:48 GMT
if a Trade Unionist tries to express an opinion by not going on strike when others are then his / her family become outcasts in their own community for generations. Strange country really. A land of freedom of speech and thought ... for some! If a member of a union does not accept the outcome of a ballot, it kind of defeats the point of being a member in the first place. That's not so say I support the 'closed shop' or the use of ostracism and violence towards others. I support the right of workers to strike, not the actions and behaviour of every trade unionist. |
|
merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
|
Post by merse on Sept 18, 2010 7:42:10 GMT
.............if a Trade Unionist tries to express an opinion by not going on strike when others are then his / her family become outcasts in their own community for generations. In some communities, yes. Some communities owe the antipathy between supporters of different football clubs to long past industrial strife...................West Ham and Millwall, Southampton and Portsmouth spring to mind. Some industries have seen such matters become the springboard for new, separate worker representation to come about; and some more enlightened industries have allowed their workers a very real and democratic ownership of their place of work. Some old school trade unionists regard "scabbing" as little different to refusing to fight in the two World Wars and have a deep objection to those people then enjoying the same benefits and hard won remunerations as those who did stand and fight................that's where the antipathy comes from and we ALL need to be aware of that whether we agree with it or not. |
|
merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
|
Post by merse on Sept 18, 2010 7:54:55 GMT
For the right, we were no longer the sick man of Europe, in thrall to the unions and in debt up to our eye balls. There was pride in the country, particularly after the Falkland's conflict and in the later 80's there was much individual opportunity. Not in debt up to our eyeballs? ~ excuse me!  Much of the "Benefit Culture" today owes it's much expanded existence due to the instigation of Thatcher's policies in that instead of underpinning the manufacturing industries with government subsidy they allowed ship building, steel making and mining to close and get replaced by Third World entrepreneurs which in turn created a larger balance of payments deficite. What's better, a state subsidised industry providing work and drip down economy, or closure and the population living off benefit and the drip down economy so run down it either ceases to exist or carries on in poverty itself? Streets and streets of closed shops boarded up and vandalised, vast numbers of the population no longer able to travel to ToryBay and spend their money ~ oh what an own goal and bollock dropping exercise by the senile old fool and those who put her in power! I bet you wished you still reaped the benefits of Glasgow Fortnight and Sheffield Wakes Week down there, but you can't because the Tory Champion killed them all off! |
|
Dave
TFF member
Posts: 13,081
|
Post by Dave on Sept 18, 2010 8:15:02 GMT
Listening to at least four different subjects being debated five times a week on the J.Vine show on radio two, I have found just how far apart people can be on the views they hold and what they believe.
In the case of Maggie some love her and some hate her and at the end of the day I’m sure she did what she thought was right for the country and as a fellow human being should not be subjected to any form of abuse.
I don’t think it matters who runs our country, they are all much the same as far as I’m concerned, never able to answer straight questions and always making promises they do not keep.
This all started because of a remark about train drivers going on strike, well I would love to earn even half what they get paid and I work a good ten hours more a week than they do and over five of them unpaid. I have not had a pay rise in over two and a half years simply because it’s all about ensuring in these difficult times we all still have a job to go to each day.
Our country is in a big mess and yes some over paid people in the public sector are going to lost their jobs, people who will get far more money from their pension than I will ever earn in a week and that pension has been paid for by the likes of us low paid workers so I won’t lose any sleep over their job loses.
There should not be talk of any strike action while things are in such a mess, imagine if we at our small company joined a trade union and they started fighting for what we should be getting paid. All that would happen is Toolfix would be no more as there would not be enough money coming into it to and it would go under.
Everyone who goes to work deserves a fair and decent wage and there is a great imbalance in this country to what some get paid and what others do and far to many now earn far more than they are ever worth or get far more than the job they do should be getting paid.
No one should have the power to bring our country down on its knees, no one should have the power to ruin such things as others long planned and paid for by hard work and savings holidays. No one should have the power to stop others from being able to get to work and earn their own living just because they want more in their wage packet.
Half the people who want MORE have far better pay and conditions than most of us have and should start thinking about how lucky they are and think about the impact any strike action has on others who do not want to live off the state and for many reasons have to earn a living doing jobs that are not that well paid but still feel proud they can just about provide for their family and proud they are not taking the easy route and living off the backs of others.
|
|
|
|
Post by aussie on Sept 18, 2010 9:06:16 GMT
`ang on a minute I was under the impression that politics and religion were taboo subjects!  |
|
keyberrygull
TFF member
Posts: 994
Favourite Player: Steve Cooper
|
Post by keyberrygull on Sept 18, 2010 9:17:59 GMT
Maggie for me any day but I will probably be sent to Coventry for having an opinion! Closed shop Who you or anyone else likes, prefers or admires is a matter for you. That surely doesn't mean others can't have or express an opinion on that. (Your little strop and spurned lover routine with Merse btw is getting very boring and tiresome for others to read.) Apologies for my boring and tiresome post but I'm sure Alan is delighted to get the odd dig from me every once in a while and more than happy to respond. IMO he his one of the best debaters on here who has an opinion on most things and never afraid to pass comment. Its not a stroppy spurned lover routine although some of the criticism i received from him on one occasion did disappoint me. Its having the bottle to provoke a heated discussion, knowing full well that your beliefs are going to be pulled to pieces by him . I would rather do that than adopt the attitude of many other members and not post anything. I just find it amazing to think that two Newton Abbot townies, albeit a generation apart , brought up in the red brick Victorian houses in the middle of town can be so far apart politically. There must be a reason for this : The way we were brought up? (certainly not in my case) The state of the nation when we were teenagers? Parental influence?  |
|
merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
|
Post by merse on Sept 18, 2010 9:59:38 GMT
Apologies for my boring and tiresome post but I'm sure Alan is delighted to get the odd dig from me every once in a while and more than happy to respond.
I just find it amazing to think that two Newton Abbot townies, albeit a generation apart , brought up in the red brick Victorian houses in the middle of town can be so far apart politically.
There must be a reason for this :
The way we were brought up? (certainly not in my case)
The state of the nation when we were teenagers?
Parental influence? I don't see Brian and I as having any "lovers' strop" ~ spurned or not................is "spurning" a combination of "spurming" and "gurning" by the way? Looking at the faces of some wnakers I guess it is!  We are no different than boxers coming out of different corners or MPs standing on either side of the House.................to me, that's what debating is; is it not? Probably we were brought up differently Brian. I am the progeny of a very argumentative mother who's father and grand father were old time socialists and amongst the original candidates from the Labour & Co-Operative Party to stand in the local elections in Newton Abbot. My father was a peace loving radical Liberal and Trade Unionist, Trades Councillor and Ratepayer's Representative who switched his political allegiance to the Labour Party when it was led by Harold Wilson and back to the Liberals when Tony B Liar and his "New Labour" movement changed the party's culture in the interests of becoming electable. My mother was Church of England, my father a lapsed Methodist who became an atheist. When I was a kid, Newton Abbot was a Labour stronghold within the old Urban District Council with a Tory MP in "Trade Unionist" Ray Mawby who I personally heard roundly denigrated and disrespected within the confines of the Conservative Club in NA by people who depended on him to win the working man's gullible vote to keep their privileged arses in power...............the "Turkeys Who Vote for Christmas" as I have called then before ~ people who would vote in a Labour councillor but a Tory MP. I never could quite figure that one out. When I was a kid, Newton Abbot was an industrial/market town with clay mining, railway workshops and engineering as it's staple and economically vibrant employment provision and that was what gave Labour a power base there..................what would you describe it as now Brian, because in all honesty I would like to know if you feel it has improved or not. When I was a kid, Torbay was the drip down beneficiary of the industrial might of South Wales, The Midlands, North and Scotland with it's tourism industry enjoying the spending power of their workers......................how would you describe it now Brian? To me, much of the light industry and technical employment that was attracted to the Bay by a cheap workforce has upped and left; frustrated by the total failure of the area to invest in the transport infrastructure and in search of even cheaper labour in the third world..................would that be a fair assumption Brian? |
|
