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Post by mickyflash on Aug 24, 2008 14:20:58 GMT
Many of us on here have discussed at length weather or not, as fans we have a right to show our disappointment in the way the team is performing, I have never booed a Torquay United team in my life, and I wasn't about to do so on Tuesday.
I am disappointed with our start to the season, of course I am, we all are, but as supporters of the club I would like to ask you a question. what will you be bringing to the game on Monday?
well, £15 I hear you say? Thats great well done, (many will stay at home) and you are well within your right to contribute financially to the club and hope your money has been invested wisely and you will be entertained with pleasing football
Is that it though? Is that enough? The players are in need of a lift, I said after the Ebbsfleet match that I hoped Buckle would come out with his hands up and admit he got it tactically wrong... he didn't and I was disappointed in that, but I was thankful that Saturdays game was away as I didn't see the players relishing another game at home after Tuesday performance, now by all accounts, It wasn't our day once again on Saturday and after reading Buckle's brief comments on the Official site I got the impression that he (Buckle) was not about to be drawn into talking about his tactics and answering the questions we all have regarding his team selection and the look of our defensive line up. which once again is disappointing for me, Because in my opinion Buckle is not protecting his players enough leaving them open to criticism. I may be wrong but I fear a us and them mentally appearing between the staff and the fans, unfortunately it appears to be being led by Buckle
If I was a Torquay United player sitting on the coach after the Crawley defeat, I certainly would not be looking forward to the prospect of Tomorrows game at home.
With is mind I will refer back to my original question, will you stand there silently until your team performs as you expect, will you wait for the first long ball or misplaced pass and jump on the players back, what if we go one nil down?
I will be supporting the players as much as possible tomorrow, in fact more so than I normally do because this is actually a time where we as fans can make the difference. Do you really think they need us when everyone is on their game, were 4 nill and the squad has gelled into a unit??? no, this is when they need us, and weather I agree with Bucks team selection tomorrow or not now is the time for us all (players included) to stand up and be counted
Now I could just end my post here but for me all of this is easier said then done, its all very well and good saying I'm a supporter, I wont boo, lets get behind the lads, but I don't deserve a pat on the back for that, I want to get into the nitty gritty of things and ask how can I support my team better? what can I do personally to create a better atmosphere within the club? Ive been thinking about it and encouragement seems to be the best word to sum things up, even the simple things, a bit of work rate, winning a throw needs to be treated with applause to instill some confidence in the side. I join in with most of the chanting generally and if appropriate, I wish more people would though, it seems too many people are turning up and watching as if they were turing on the tele to watch Eastenders, only making an impression in the match when they dont like the storyline
So, what is that you will bring to game?
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Aug 24, 2008 14:45:44 GMT
I had to put 10 names on my list this morning, all members who had made great posts yesterday and this morning, now I have to add this weeks champ as well to the list.
I sit here at times and try to come up with good ideas for the forum, well post of the week was one I thought was a brain wave, now I'm not so sure. Why? because I continue to be amazed by the posts written on this forum and with all the great posts this weekend alone and more I hope to come in the week, just how do I pick just one.
Don't get me wrong, I'm frilled to bits its going to be so hard, I know for myself I have really loved wanting to post again and I hope all those who have made all these top posts, will know that on here, you will not just get your post put in a quote box and the word I agree added to your post. I really hope as has been the case that your efforts will be rewarded by good posts added to yours in response to any points etc you have made.
I keep having to say thank you on here, but thats OK, so thanks one and all again for your great posts.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Aug 24, 2008 15:27:47 GMT
Micky, the club needs its younger supporters as well as getting as many kids involved with the club as possible, you really are the future of the club as far as supporters go.
You will find its mostly the younger fans who will be doing the singing, they are the ones who will proclaim they are Torquay till they die, but some of them will only be short term supporters.
I have seem the young ones who find a girlfriend, they walk down the road together, wrapped around each other so much, you wonder how they are able to walk at all. They will write in the cards to each other, how they will always be together, nothing will ever part them and when they write it, they believe they truly mean it.
Their love may survive, but its more likely it will end and they will find new loves and probably more than just one.You will find that older supporters like me and others on this forum, all felt the way of the young supporters today, when we were younger, we all sang the songs and pledged our love and support forever to our club.
Maybe its just that we are older and simply don't shout so much at games these days, maybe it does not move us in the same way it once did, who knows? I will be there tomorrow, I will not boo, no matter how the game goes, I will shout if we score and give my praise where it is due. I can do no more, the rest will be up to the players to bring out the rest in me.
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Post by sean01 on Aug 24, 2008 15:40:22 GMT
I think that some people on both sites tend to forget that the board are supporters of TUFC and want success as much as the "fans" who seem to vent their anger at Paul Buckle. At all football clubs there will be scenarios like we have now (poor run of form) this is the time for all supporters at the club to pull in the same direction. The laughable suggestion of changing managers after a handfull of games is crazy. I note no other club in all five divisions have sacked their manager. What gives TUFC the devine right to win every game, I am dissapointed with some of the performances, but how can this be the managers fault every time when I witnessed two player mistakes with the penalties one player who has been captain and at the club for over 3 years the other on his debut. All week posters have asked for changes, Paul makes changes, then he is slated. My own conclusion is whatever Paul does at this club certain posters will not forgive him for last season. There seems to be an agenda to get "Buckle out" however this voice box they use is only a small minority of the TUFC fan base. Most fans either remain quiet and back the manager or are shocked at the vile bear bateing of our young manager. Carry on guys you just might get what you deserve. As for the inuendos about Rayner and Phillips I know the truth and all of you are way of the mark, Pauls manmanagement secured the dressing room. Get behind the manager and the team. This is when they need you the most, its easy supporting when winning, it laudable supporting when we are having a difficult time.
End of rant !!!
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merse
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Post by merse on Aug 24, 2008 15:52:09 GMT
 At least we didn't appoint Julien Dicks as our manager. As soon as we lost a couple of games the idiots would be chanting "Dicks out, Dicks out" ;D
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Aug 24, 2008 16:00:10 GMT
Thanks for you views Sean, I believe most of the posters want to support not only the club but also the manager, as regards Raynor and Phillips, we can only relay what we hear, it is not the fault of anyone if the club at times hide things when they really have no need to do so. As I have said before, keeping fans to much in the dark, only leads to divisions, when as you say we really should all be pulling the same way.
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Post by sean01 on Aug 24, 2008 16:17:26 GMT
You are correct Dave most of the fans actually do support the Manager, unfortunatly they choose not to voice their support due to various reasons ie no internet access, fear of being lambasted by certain agenda serving posters. On one poll on the other site approx 130 posters voted on "buckle out" this being 5% of the last home game. I dont actually know what the split was but say 50 - 50. That means approx 2.5% of the home base have vented their spleen. I wish "fans" would leave the guy alone and dont put him under pressure. Let him do the job with the full support of the"fans".
As for Raynor and Phillips why would the club wish to discuss the back ground to the leaving of both players. Its not about hideing things as you say, its about good practice not to discuss any dealings in public. It is a shame that Raynor has gone public, I read the piece he put in the Crawley programme in the boardroom yesterday with the other TUFC directors. Seems like time has clouded his mind and actual events. Professional clubs never disclose behind door events.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Aug 24, 2008 16:28:23 GMT
I would hope Sean that you see the difference with the posters on this forum, no Buckle out threads have been started, no polls started on should he go and no threads on who should be the next manager.
I'm sure you understand that a forum is a place to be able to air your views, as you know some fans have complained that after making contact with the club, they received very little response.It will always be the case, due mainly to how losing games effect some posters, that as they post in anger and disappointment, they often seem to be complaining and demanding some sort of action.
The time may come if results and performances do not improve, when those at the club, the same ones who we know are fans just like us really, would want to take action. I for one hope it would never come to that, but this is football and managers do get judged on the results they get.
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Post by sean01 on Aug 24, 2008 18:24:01 GMT
Dave,
I have taken the time over the past few hours to re look at your posts reference Paul Buckle. I think that you should re look at your posts and confirm where you stand on this agenda. Maybe I am reading between the lines, however, I think erveryone should come clean where they stand on this subject.
My oponion is Paul Buckle stays and builds a winning team for the future.
Whats yours?
I mean this is someones job were talking about here.!!!!
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Post by jimd on Aug 24, 2008 18:27:16 GMT
At least we didn't appoint Julien Dicks as our manager. As soon as we lost a couple of games the idiots would be chanting "Dicks out, Dicks out" ;D  |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Aug 24, 2008 18:30:36 GMT
OK had to break off from the PC after my last post,as we needed to go out for a Roast, so now back I want to pick up on a few points you made Sean, I also see you did not reply to my last post,reference the threads running on this forum.
Your use of figures is just what any politician, might try to use to win any argument or defend any decision they may have made. Nick Bye would be happy to tell you he only got 50 written complaints against the seafront balloon, therefore all the rest of the Bay have to be supporting his decision to put it there.
The way you have put your argument, is no different, so as only 130 voted and half wanted him to go, 2.5% of those who go to Plainmoor, surly you are not trying to suggest the other 97.5% are all happy and fully supporting the manager.
You already know my views on what I once called the secret seven, I did agree, there will be times(transfer dealings etc) when things need to be kept out of the public eye.
You should not lose sight of the fact that fans are paying customers, without them, each and everyone running the club, might as well pack up and go home. If a club really wants its fans to feel they really are a part of that club, keeping fans more informed would go along way.
When in a promotional season the NO1 keeper is put out on loan, harming the chances for the team to gain promotion, why should fans not ask why. Failure to give any good reason to the fans, only give fans the opportunity to speculate, why? because they do need some answers. Do you think you can just expect people to turn up every game, hand over THEIR money and then take the attitude that what they don't need to know won't hurt them.
I do not know what Raynor wrote in the program notes yesterday, If what he says is not true, why would the club not challenge it, surly the club would only want the real truth and not what some ex player was now claiming happened.
I will wait with interest to see how things turn out for Paul Buckle, any pressure he is under, is not down to fans who have expressed their views on a forum, I think the booing at the games would have had more of any effect on him, he is also under pressure because his team selections and game plans have not yet worked, this is also not down to any posts made on a forum.
Forums will have mixed views Sean, sorry they will never be full of just happy clappers, as someone who runs a forum, I need a complete mix of views, to get debate going, if it happens then the forum is doing what it set out to achieve. In the same token a manager who has a winning side, that is keeping the club and the fans happy, has also achieved what one would hope he set out to do.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Aug 24, 2008 18:36:33 GMT
just seen your post Sean and will repy shortly
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Post by sean01 on Aug 24, 2008 18:43:07 GMT
Dave you will find that in life most people accept the status quo. when people complain they express themselfs either in writing or protest. You will never get people writing or marching expressing their happiness at the situation. They are called the silent majority. Unfortunatly you do seem to have an axe to grind. Politics no thank you, factual based evidence I will let you make your own mind up.
On the Raynor progamme notes why would TUFC react to it? no player is bigger then the club. It shows great professional nouse to remain quiet on this subject. Lets see how long he lasts at Crawley especially with Mr Evans in charge.
Lets get behind Paul Buckle and his young team.
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Post by buster on Aug 24, 2008 18:53:45 GMT
Sean
Sport is like no ther business. It is driven by the heart. Without this passion you would not see people spending hours on the motorway chasing a dream. Forums, fights and phone ins. Adults shouting at the TV and being plunged into the depths of despair or found screaming with joy. So the club must understand rational and irrational behaviour comes with running a club. The board has an agenda and they must get on with it.
It is only right and proper that you rise to the defence of Utd given your association. I however detected no empathy for the fan. I hope you have not forgotten your roots.
I`m sure the club does not want to alienate itself from the fan base. These are emotionally and financially difficult times for the followers of the Gulls. A recent post stated the Crawley gate was down from 600 to 257.
I had hoped the old chestnut of communication had been laid to rest. But for me the jury is still out.
As for where my allegiance lies. Firmly with the Gulls and no other club nor country gets a look in.
Do I support the current management & players? Yes 100%. But the club must understand that it should not take the fans for granted. A little PR from the board now and again wouldn`t go a miss. Or if action needs taking it should be dealt with swiftly with a brief press announcement and the player released. I am assuming here that there are players that are no longer wanted given their lack of appearance. Probably completely barking up the wrong tree.
buster
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Aug 24, 2008 19:02:36 GMT
I have an Axe to grind? with who or what, please let me know.
I have not read all my posts on this forum I have made, if I had I may well find that one post may have contradicted another post made on a different day, it happens, as you tend to post on how you may feel the day you made the post.
I think I have made my views very well known on the forum, I believe I have stated that we should be supporting the manager at this time, maybe its you who should read all the threads and take a more balanced view of my messages on here.
I have said that we should see where the team is after 12 games, I also stated that I still felt that even then we should not be calling for Buckles head. So maybe its you who has some axe to grind with me, who knows?
I learned along time ago that footballs clubs do not know what loyalty is nor do they let compassion stand in their way. I have seem many players over the years removed from the club, players who had given their all, only to find a new manager, or something else has seen that player treated very poorly.
Yes I know its Buckles job, I have asked for him to be sacked? no i don't think I have, but it matters not if it is job or not, if he fails to do it as expected, he stands to be sacked just like the rest of the people who go to work.
Are you trying to tell me, that no matter what results he got, lets say we are close to going down at the end of this season, that the board will still back him 100%? if they did, what effect do you think it would have on the gates.
Its no good coming on here trying to make out I have an axe to grind, I did not pick the team, I did not set out the game plan, I'm a fan who has a point of view and I will make it when I feel I need too.
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At least we didn't appoint Julien Dicks as our manager.
