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Post by longeatongull on Feb 27, 2009 21:14:06 GMT
I have just heard Dave has had to pack up this forum due to him meeting and running away with a couple of sisters (he thinks!!) ;D ;D Sorry I have never PM'd anybody -so cant blame me--his opinions like everybodies were interesting but hell they were rubbish,negative and just posted to wind everybody up. Sorry from me he wont be missed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Keep the faith with PB!!
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Feb 27, 2009 22:10:46 GMT
Don't worry longeatongull I would not think you would send Dave Shaw any PMs the ones I was referring to happened some time ago and most members could work out who sent them and when you think where Dave Lives, you could guess their content. If we did not go up this season, he may well come back and be singing a song by GARY GLITTERI'm back I'm back as a matter of fact I'm backAs I'm sure he will want to tell us how he was right all along.
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tufc01
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Post by tufc01 on Feb 28, 2009 9:13:49 GMT
I have just heard Dave has had to pack up this forum due to him meeting and running away with a couple of sisters (he thinks!!) ;D ;D Sorry I have never PM'd anybody -so cant blame me--[glow=yellow,2,300]his opinions like everybodies were interesting but hell they were rubbish,negative and just posted to wind everybody up.[/glow]Sorry from me he wont be missed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Keep the faith with PB!! This quite a tricky subject to broach but I will make an effort to give my slant on why i don't think he will be missed. It was, as you say, “his opinions like everybody’s were interesting but hell they were rubbish, negative and just posted to wind everybody up”. But also because he never gave his reasons why or how his opinion was formed, he never backed it up, just spouted. I would have had much more respect for his posts had he given his reasons behind them. These following opinions are based on indisputable facts, but facts none the less. People then have their own ‘take’ on these facts, form an opinion and express it, and then most of us probably defend our opinion to the hilt, rarely changing it. If we take one of the more controversial opinions (one that I still do not share) Sack Paul Buckle because; 1. Didn’t get us promoted last season 2. Used to be assistant manager at Exeter 3. Only 4 wins in the last 12 games 4. Mentioned Weymouth situation in an interview (before you come back on this, I’m trying to make a point, I know you didn’t say sack him because of it) 5. He is only 5 ft 7 inches (thank the lord for Wikipedia) (obviously Wikipedia is no guarantee of this actually being true, but run with me on this one) The opinion, of Sack Paul Buckle, is based on 5 things that are true, but at least it provides a reason behind the opinion and allows me/others to counter these opinions and a healthy debate ensues, which is the objective of a truly good FORUM. (which this ABSOLUTELY is) Don’t sack Paul Buckle because; 1. We finished Third in the league and got to the final of the premier non league cup (and were robbed) 2. Nothing wrong with Exeter. I live just outside the city, i socialise in there all the time (last night went for a meal & the pictures), it’s a great place to live. The council have done all the right things regarding redevelopment. 3. We are in a play off position and we have games in hand over the two teams immediately above us. 4. The Weymouth situation is an absolutely farce. It does affect our team and would be unfair if the league do not address this by at least removing ALL Weymouth games from this season from the league tables. 5. It matters not a jot what height he is. This has no bearing on his managerial skills what so ever. Take Alan Ball he was even shorter and look how successful he was, didn’t he help Exeter get relegated?? My counter opinions all address the original statement and I put my case forward to support my opinion, all of which are left so that someone can and will counter my opinion. Some are stronger arguments than others and some are harder to defend, but at least an opinion is formed and supported with my reasons. The point is, my 5 reasons for not sacking him could, in theory, lead to even more debate on non Buckle related subjects i.e. Exeter redevelopment compared to Torquay’s lack of it, The Weymouth situation, Alan Balls managerial skills. This is where my issue with Dave Shaw’s posts lay. He always had an opinion and I wouldn’t have minded how controversial it was as long as it was supported by some rhyme or reason, no matter how tenuous it was. I’m not saying that everyone needs to substantiate or justify their opinions, what I am saying is if your opinion is so far left of centre (or right) then at least back it up with a reason for this, at least that way you get some respect for your opinion. This is why Merse, and now Fonda, get lots of replies to their posts. I apologise for naming people, but these two have opinions from opposite ends of the spectrum from each other, always give reasons to support their opinions, which some agree with and some don’t, but it certainly creates a good debate. That’s why I have much more respect for their posts than I ever had with Dave Shaw’s posts. Wouldn’t it have been better to say sack Paul Buckle BECAUSE he didn’t get us promoted last season and THEN replace him with Sven Goran Erickson. WHY?? Because he is a good manager and he is available. NEVER going happen but boy would it create a lively debate. First of all on the issue of the sacking and then on the issue of the replacement. Yes everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but do we NEED him on the forum?? No we do not need him and I think the forum is actually better off without him. That’s my opinion, I have given my reasons, I expect several responses, including one that calls me a Tw*t and says I spout emotional claptrap. Emotional claptrap yes, but with a perspective to why I’m thinking that.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Feb 28, 2009 9:50:44 GMT
tufc01 you are a Tw*t and spout emotional claptrap there I said it, but then you know that I don't think that and you have given your views on Dave and have fully explained your reasons and that is how it should be done. As the guy who runs the forum and only wants it to be a success, I have to take the view that while I should be free to post and argue my points of views as a member on here, I can't allow myself to judge my fellow members based on their views. What disappoints me at times is when I have gone to great trouble to help resolve problems for a member and then they leave or stop using the forum with out a word as to why. Merse has a friend who is still a member but won't use the forum, upset by a post that I really failed to see any problem with it and then I received an email and was told in it not to reply.Yet this person had problems before logging on the forum, I gave Merse my mobile number to give to him and then spent time sorting his problems out. I guess its just life really, but I have always been here to help and would hope most see me more as a friend. Why did Dave Shaw delete his account yesterday? he received no attacking posts on the thread he started and posted one hour before he left, maybe he did receive a PM he did not like, but due to the ones he received before, I put in a code that allows any member to block PMs from any member they do not want to be sent PMs from. When he got those PMs, I sent a PM to the sender and then had to talk with him on the phone and make it clear that the PMs of that nature had to stop, if not I would use another code I had put in that would allow me to stop him sending PMs to anyone on the forum. So I think Dave was treated the same as all members are and just deleting the account with out sending a PM, or just making a post on the forum disappoints me. If your angry or upset why not just not log on for a while, deleting accounts still leaves the posts on the forum and then they just show up as a guest post, I must confess I do not like seeing posts just appear as guests posts. Still unless he comes back we will never know the reasons and he is free to rejoin if he wanted to.
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Post by Budleigh on Feb 28, 2009 10:55:31 GMT
As anybody who knows me will tell you, i'm fairly mild mannered, laid back and not one to shout my mouth off. As such I don't tend to place anything on here that may cause offence, stir things up or break a trust in anything I may've been told or heard. Therefore when I saw one of Dave Shaw's posts that was way off the mark I sent him a polite message explaining that, although I couldn't divulge any actual info, I had reason to believe what he had written to be incorrect and explained it in a basic scenario. I had a really lovely message back from him telling me he understood that I couldn't give out personal information but would trust what I'd inferred in this instance. He also said how much he was looking forward to jetting over for the play-off final. I'm not in any way trying to defend the man because he did come out with some negative thoughts and suggestions but he did have the decency to concede on this, and one other point in personal corresspondence. I would suggest that as someone so far away this was his main way of keeping in touch with like minded (well maybe not quite!) souls but had a way about him that rubbed people up the wrong way. I did enjoy reading some of his stuff, although I wanted to thump my keyboard at times, but rather like texting, emailing etc it's very difficult to gauge a person who one has never met but relying only on the written word. A pain in the arse, certainly, but underneath it I think he enjoyed putting the boot in to get a reaction. And this a man whose opinion on the current managemant was 100% oppposite to mine! True, he may well not be missed on here but I think he himself would miss it and when you live on the other side of the world and this is one of your main ways of retaining contact with something important to you, then that's a shame.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Feb 28, 2009 11:05:12 GMT
I'm sure when Jamie comes back from his holiday he will have a chat with Dave and we will at least find out his reasons and one would hope that being so far away he will indeed miss hearing our views and will come back onto the forum.
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Feb 28, 2009 22:38:01 GMT
DaveR. I'm not convinced mentioning a Gary Glitter song was the best thing in the context of your earlier post!!!!
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Feb 28, 2009 22:49:27 GMT
DaveR. I'm not convinced mentioning a Gary Glitter song was the best thing in the context of your earlier post!!!! Rob I take it your post was just a light hearted remark the song choice was made only in case some had not worked out the nature of some PMs sent to Dave, as I said they were out of order and i sorted it out for Dave.
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Feb 28, 2009 23:10:42 GMT
DaveR. I'm not convinced mentioning a Gary Glitter song was the best thing in the context of your earlier post!!!! Rob I take it your post was just a light hearted remark the song choice was made only in case some had not worked out the nature of some PMs sent to Dave, as I said they were out of order and i sorted it out for Dave. Ah. Now i'm with you, Dave. Can't understand why some would stoop to that. His views are generally as unsubstantiated as tufc01 points out, but you were right to act on such unfair PM's.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Feb 28, 2009 23:32:47 GMT
No problems Rob, I should point out that the PMs were not sent by BudleighGull, they were sent some time ago by someone we have not seen on the forum for a while
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Mar 2, 2009 23:44:36 GMT
This quite a tricky subject to broach but I will make an effort to give my slant on why i don't think he will be missed. It was, as you say, “his opinions like everybody’s were interesting but hell they were rubbish, negative and just posted to wind everybody up”. But also because he never gave his reasons why or how his opinion was formed, he never backed it up, just spouted. I would have had much more respect for his posts had he given his reasons behind them. I must admit that I am with TUFC01 all the way on this one. I will not miss this particular poster’s input at all as he never DEBATED anything. He just ASSERTED the same thing time and again and was then insulting of anyone who disagreed – invariably labelling them as weak-minded, weak-willed, naïve, subservient creatures who read tabloid newspapers and vote Tory. It was a style we witnessed from somebody else who went a long way to destroying Mervo’s site by driving away reasonable posters with one track obsessional rants which either ignored facts or twisted and distorted them to support a pre-conceived position. TUFC01 says that there was never any fact or substance behind the one-eyed rants, but I would go further and say that occasionally the rants were based on blatantly incorrect assertions – although anyone pointing this out would receive the old head-nodding, cap-doffing, Daily Mail reading nonsense. There was obviously a preconception that Buckle makes mistakes and never learns from them. One assertion he made to support this was that Buckle did not make any signings last January and, having failed to learn from this mistake, would not make any this January. Andy C took the trouble to list all the players we signed last January, but still the rant – which flew in the face of the facts – carried on. He could have argued that last season Buckle made too many changes in January – that losing the aggressive Mansell/Hargreaves combination to accommodate the more pedestrian Adams and breaking up the successful Sills/Phillips combination to accommodate the less physical Dsane had taken away the rhythm we had before Christmas – although most agreed at the time that these were quality signings which increased our options. He could have argued that Buckle was now over-compensating and doing the polar opposite of last year to avoid risking unsettling the team. Now you could agree or disagree with that ARGUMENT, but the (false) ASSERTION that Buckle was repeating last year’s error was utterly ridiculous. You cannot argue or debate with somebody who pays no attention to the real facts. To my mind, this kind of rabid assertion actually hardens opinion amongst the open-minded against the view stated. I am sure there are grains of truth in some of the complaints made (much as there was a lot of truth in the dissatisfaction with Bateson of the other poster I mentioned). But dressing up all misgivings with a load of rhetoric and a load of inaccurate assertions just makes the poster look obsessional and / or agenda-driven. It would be much better to present a balanced case with a logical conclusion.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2009 0:06:53 GMT
Yes everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but do we NEED him on the forum?? No we do not need him and I think the forum is actually better off without him. I'm using this quote - pretty much at random - to think aloud (with a certain amount of tongue in cheek and degree of Devil's advocacy) about how we communicate - and relate to each other - when it comes to football. A number of my friendships stem from a shared interest in the game. Other friendships, mercifully, have absolutely nothing to do with the Great Obsession. Over the years I've met some great people through football (and continue to do so) - haven't we all? - although I also know that Saturday afternoon commitments (and Tuesday evenings and..) have probably prevented me from developing a wider range of interests. Swings and roundabouts - I think I've come out on top - and we all know what we've gained from being interested in the game, don't we? I hope so anyway. But do you ever meet people you wish weren't interested in football? I don't mean the people who mildly disagree with you but the extremists who spout relentless garbage and expect you to agree with them. How do you handle them? I cringe sometimes when I go halfway in agreeing with the buggers just to keep the peace. Sometimes it's a recipe for disaster when there's yet another irrational rant about this player, that manager, that referee. I'm sure with some people it's football that makes them so bloody disagreeable. Take the game out of the equation and they'd be far better company. Then there are the bores who go on and on about their bloody team but never watch them (getting all their views off the web and 6-0-6). I used to work with one who routinely told me, in considerable detail, about how his team did - right down to individual performances - as he painted the bathroom at the time listening to Five Live. Some mornings he would ask how Torquay played the previous evening. The reply might be " I didn't actually make it to Hartlepool last night so can't really say" but the response would still be " yes, but how did they play?" After many years of this type of conversation I've concluded - and I hope this doesn't sound too pious - that people who regularly watch football are happiest talking with others who go to games (yes, some of my best friends are Exeter City season ticket holders). And, likewise, I guess that - ultimately - those who watch all their football on terrestial telly are probably happiest talking to those who do the same rather than grappling with us funny obsessional buggers. I know I should be applauding the all-in inclusiveness and community spirit which supposedly accompanies the World Cup and European Championships but - I'm afraid to say - I really can't handle the "will England win tonight?" small talk from people who, ordinarily, never show any interest in the game. I'd rather talk about the weather or the latest set of targets. Bloody hell, is it just me?
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Mar 4, 2009 0:28:55 GMT
It certainly isn't Barton. I agree with pretty much every word you say.
Last season with Aldershot in the same league, I got to talk to many local(to where I live) Shots diehards, with whom my team now played in the same League. And I thoroughly enjoyed the season for it.
When I hear talk of Premiership football, "What is Skirtl's best position?", "Is playing Ronaldo on the right again the inevitable sacrifice for signing Berbatov?", I can't help but overhear, and form an opinion, but it's usually one along the lines of "Go and watch a game. You are not Alan Hansen, or worse, Mark Lawrenson".
I suppose where I slightly differ is that I enjoy the mood of others when things are going well for England at major competitions. But the moment we go out, final whistle onwards, I really can't be doing with some half-baked analysis from someone who clearly does not deserve my scorn for their observations.
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Post by ealinggull on Mar 4, 2009 1:02:21 GMT
to follow the thread subjectagain ......... I see Aggy's corner led to the Exeter equaliser tonight!
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Post by crispygull on Mar 18, 2009 20:38:24 GMT
Seems like Exeter are now on the verge of getting Stuart Fleetwood (ex FGR) in on loan for the rest of the season! I hate to admit it, but after initially being unsure whether Paul Tisdale was a decent Manager or not, and thinking that some of his signings were a bit "iffy" he has by and large proved me wrong, and (through gritted teeth) I must admit I think he is probably a Manager who will probably (hopefully!) go on to bigger and better things. Some of his signings have proved to be fantastic - Rob Edwards, Matt Taylor, Steve Basham, Ryan Harley all played a big part in winning them promotion and even though some of his signings last summer didnt seem that great, they have also played a part in what has so far been a pretty successful campaign. His more recent additions have also been very impressive with the likes of Marcus Stewart, Alex Russell and a young lad called Troy Archibald-Henville who they have brought in on loan from Spurs being added to the squad at just the right time to enable them to push on for that automatic promotion spot which is very much in reach. And now, of course, it looks as though they will be bringing Fleetwood in. There is a question mark over whether he can do the business at that level - he has certainly struggled to get goals while out on loan to League One clubs this year (Brighton and Cheltenham) and it was also true to say that the goals did dry up for him after Mark Beesley (his main supplier) left FGR for Cambridge in January of last year - but if he can rediscover the form he was showing last Autumn, he could well score the goals to fire them all the way to League One! Funnily enough, I did wonder a few weeks back whether he might have been a target of ours. I think it was Merse who said (when in conversation with a TUFC Director) that we were apparently after a striker that would "transform our season", that his name came to mind as a possible target as at the time he was just coming to the end of a 3 month loan spell at Brighton and there seemed little future for him back at Charlton, who I would imagine would be pretty keen to offload him as he hasnt shown anything this season to indicate that he could be successful at Championship level. I would imagine that there must be a strong possibility that if he were to be successful at Exeter and get them promoted to League One (where Charlton are heading anyway) there must be a chance that the deal could be made permanent in the summer? As for whether he was a target of ours .... presumably not, as shortly afterwards we anounced the signing of Iyesden "the transformer" Christie ...
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