Dave
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Post by Dave on Jan 14, 2009 19:34:43 GMT
Everywhere I go during my working day, I talk Torquay United, in Devon, Dorset, Somerset and Cornwall, so many people know I'm a fan and chat football with me. Its only on a Wednesday that I work more nearer home, top of Cornwall and then the South hams, Torbay and Teignbridge, its the only day I can pop in home for a coffee.
Today while calling in to see a customer in Torbay I was saddened and disappointed about how he felt and the reasons why he felt that way.This was a person who once was a fan of TUFC, always went and his kids when young were part of the Junior supporters club. Things changed in his life, the kids grew up and he stopped going to Plainmoor.
Over the last six years we have always talked about the club, he still must have followed the club and all its news, as he always was in the know about who we just signed etc.The number of times I have tried to get him to go to a game, telling him how good the team was now playing, what great entertainment we were now getting up at Plainmoor.
Well when I went to his company today, his first words to me were, I will never go to plainmoor ever again so I just had to ask why.
He took his wife and grandchildren to the Kiddy game, he was hoping the kids would enjoy it at plainmoor and was thinking it could be a regular outing for them all. Only he and his wife were disgusted by what they were subject to at plainmoor and really were not expecting what they heard.
Yes, its the singing from the group who stand at the back on the popside near the entrance steps, singing their song the referee's a C**t, he and his wife left before the game finished and who can blame them and they were planning to come to the next game and also the Coventry game.
I now feel so strongly about this that I'm going to be talking to the club about it, we need to rid our ground of such disgusting filth, that has no place where families and decent people go, to enjoy a football match. Why are so many just putting up with it, surly you can't be happy with it, surly you can't defend it by saying its just what happens at football matches.
Have you heard it sung at other grounds, by home fans? I would not expect so and I will no longer just put up with it and its time the club put a stop to it. Let songs like this continue and what will be next? lets all make some loud noise over this and get plainmoor back to a decent respectable ground where families and young children can go and not be subject to what some fans think is big and clever to sing now.
Some wonder why people don't want to go to football matches, well I can come up with plenty of reasons and the above story is just one of them.
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merse
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Post by merse on Jan 14, 2009 19:51:43 GMT
 Whilst I don't think you can reasonably expect to eliminate swearing from the football environment, the elimination of organised group profanity and obscenity really should have a zero tolerance policy from the club via it's stewards that should lead to ejection and even arrest. It's got to be a breach of the ground regulations in any case. It's an unfortunate fact of life that if you get a collection of sillies all together you will get silly behaviour - just ride on any school hours bus! But the story you tell Dave, is endemic of why certain people will not entertain going to football. I'm right there with you in any effort you make to encourage the club to be more pro-active in preventing such anti social behaviour.
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midlandstufc
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Post by midlandstufc on Jan 14, 2009 20:02:15 GMT
Totally agree! And it's up to our fans to make it stop. I've done it myself - a quick word of "Language Timothy" and point to the kids that are about, has done the trick for me in the past. But then I'm at away matches where the behaviour of some of our comrades is generally better anyway. No need for F and Cs. Anyone saying it in front of their Mum at home would get battered - no need for anything different at Plainmoor. Time for the club to locate them, take some pictures and shame them in the paper! The next step if it continues is recourse to the law - a few £50 fines and that should sort it. Can I still call the ref a w@nker though??  |
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Jan 14, 2009 20:13:19 GMT
Can I still call the ref a w@nker though?? Only if he deserves it, you get bet your bottom dollar that the Popside lino will be like Tommy................. |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Jan 14, 2009 21:17:47 GMT
Merse I know that some swear words will always be used at games, but what we have now is as you described an organized group of young fans who now sing this song, even worse is the drummer plays his part and always bangs the drum on the the C word.
I know we will never see at football matches the sort of family days out capitalgull described about the sports he watched in the USA, but we have now gone down a road at the club, of pure filth and lowlife behavior.
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Post by forevertufc on Jan 14, 2009 21:28:15 GMT
i do agree with the sentiments behind this ,but like midlands have done it myself.
i have been to live matchs across all the divisions,including clubs like leeds who have large groups of fans noted for their bad behaviour,it happens every where,zero tolerence is not the right way forward ,if remove a fan every time the red mist falls and he swears at the ref this could lead to trouble .
the reason why i metioned leeds ,i went their to see them play when they were a div 2 side and when they where premier league ,and they have a family encloser at eland road ,where they do have a zero tolerence policy ,fans are made well aware that if they go in this area and swear they will be removed from the ground.
i think this is the way forward for torquay ,zero tolrence in the family stand ,and a blind eye to swearing on the pop side.
advertise the fact their will be zero tolrence in the family stand,
then fans can make an imformed choice about which area of the ground they enter ,with out complaint
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Post by Swanny on Jan 14, 2009 22:07:08 GMT
How about a brief tannoy announcement before a home match reminding supporters not to use foul language, and they risk being ejected if they do ? I seem to remember this has been done before at Plainmoor, hasn't it ?
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merse
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Post by merse on Jan 14, 2009 22:11:13 GMT
"Forever" - Whilst you make a valid and constructive argument for "zero tolerance" zones in Family stands, you clearly haven't taken the care to read that I advocated zero tolerance to organised singing of profanities and obscenities. The message from organised singing will percolate into the Family Stand anyhow. If the drummer is clearly a part of this, what the hell are we doing encouraging the cretin by paying for an instrument he clearly hasn't got the brains to play anyway? Even I can bang out a mean rythm on a snare drum and I'm really challenged musically!
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Jan 14, 2009 22:16:07 GMT
forevertufc, I'm talking about one word here, not all swearing as such, there is no defense for putting the c word in any song and if fans can't sing without the need to use this word, then I would rather have no singing.
I have said before that the songs that do not have swear words in them, are the ones that get sung the loudest, simply because so many more will join in. If we want to start getting more people back to watching football at plainmoor, we as a crowd can show we are not a bunch of foul mouthed lower class people, because that is how we seemed to one family who went to the Kiddy game.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Jan 14, 2009 22:28:04 GMT
Merse the drum has been played by someone else the last few games and not Joe, I would point out it was bad at the Kiddy game, but while it was started a few times at the Blackpool game, it never got to much support and as a result did not get very loud.
At the Rushen game the ref was poor and the ground only had 1700 in it, it was started many times and was very loud and it was this game that I listened and heard the drummer banging the drum on the c word.
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Jan 14, 2009 22:46:50 GMT
As a chant, it'll fizzle out. "You don't know what you're doing" or, my personal favourite when vexed "You're not fit to referee" should be shouted out by one or two nearby if the chant starts and chances are they'll sing that instead.
As far as I'm concerned, they can still be w*nkers on occassion.
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Post by forevertufc on Jan 14, 2009 22:56:37 GMT
forevertufc, I'm talking about one word here, not all swearing as such, there is no defense for putting the c word in any song and if fans can't sing without the need to use this word, then I would rather have no singing. I have said before that the songs that do not have swear words in them, are the ones that get sung the loudest, simply because so many more will join in. If we want to start getting more people back to watching football at plainmoor, we as a crowd can show we are not a bunch of foul mouthed lower class people, because that is how we seemed to one family who went to the Kiddy game. dave dont get me wrong i hate the use of the 'c' word aswell, just dont think their is away of stopping it ,if clubs go down the road of removing fans for swearing i.e all swear words you could end up with riots on your hands. and i think you will lose more fans than you gain,football can emotional ,and creates passion in the most placid of people ,dont try to take that away. |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Jan 14, 2009 23:03:02 GMT
forevertufc, we are talking about a group of young fans here, who do not need to be thrown out, but a strong word in their ears will do to start with, I hardly think they will be starting any riots ;D
How many fans may just not want to be a part of the crowd because of this song, you can lose fans in lots of ways and if it came down to a simple choice which ones I would rather lose, then I think you could work out the winner.
One more point, we have in all the years I have been going to football, never had or felt the need for a song like this, so why should it be seen as being OK now, its not and its got to go.
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Post by chrish on Jan 14, 2009 23:27:15 GMT
I think that I actually learned how to swear on the the old popside back in the day when I thought "crikey" or "bloody hell fire" was racey terminology. I will admit that when I first heard the mentionned song it did make me chuckle as to be fair I thought the ref was being one at the time. However the shock and surprise value kind of loses its initial appeal (like Little Britain) when people drone on again and again when they try and attach it to situations unlike the initial situation that caused it in the first place.
I think that there's always a place for a bit of swearing in football provided that it doesn't use the C word, not too many F words and is done with a bit of you know what in the head department. What's happened here is that Roddy McDowell, Cornelius and their mob have stumbled on something amusing and have decided to do a Matt Lucas and David Walliams and flog it to death until that joke isn't funny any more, (its too close to home and its too near the bomb)!!
I think however that it's right to have a zero tolerance policy in certain parts of the ground. If people want to take their kids to the game then its understandable that in the family stand no swearing should be tolerated. Judging by some posts on here, there's been problems in the family stand with certain fans having issues with stewards already.
So is it the actual swearwords we don't to hear or is it more to do that swearing is incorporated into an organised chant or song? Does swearing become more acceptable if its just born of sheer frustration because on inept play, a dirty tackle, a clueless ref and/or a hopeless assistant? If random bloke shouts out "ref you're fecking hopeless", it would make me laugh I guess.
I don't want football to become sanitised. If I want to sit in library while people around me only talk like they're in an Enid Blyton adventure or like Ben Fogle then I would go and watch Wasps. However I don't want to hear F and C words chanted in the same fashion every week by the Trade Union of Toilet Mouths. The problem is of course do we actually have stewards who are able to police this in a sensible manner or will they just see red and eject a supporter who might have let his passion and/or frustration spill over into a brief foul mouthed rant?
Zero Tolerance in the Grandstand and Family Stand, plus a crack down on organised swearing in songs.
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Post by stuartB on Jan 14, 2009 23:33:26 GMT
It has a lot ot do with where to stand or sit. i can't hear or make out that the C word is being sung or shouted. We get a better class of swearing down our end of the popside.
Phil (chelston) has a great turn of phrase but we haven't heard "pultroon" for a while.
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