hector
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Post by hector on Oct 28, 2014 0:14:37 GMT
Who's it to be then, Stefano? Up the A38 for the Chiefs; or the other direction for the Albion? Newton Abbot doing well these days; a fine win against Exmouth yesterday. But what's this? South West One (West); Ivybridge top of the table (although defeated for the first time yesterday). I think I'm right in saying this is one step above Torquay Athletic. Speaking of whom, Tics beat St Ives 66-0 yesterday. The visitors ninth defeat out of nine, mind. But you can only beat what's in front of you. Keep in touch, Stef! Well the big problem I have is that TUFC is too engrained and even if I fought against the urge wherever I am on Saturday the first score I will be looking out for both at half time and full time will be the Gulls at Kidderminster. I spent a lot of time in Kidderminster in my younger days as mother in law used to live there so beating them always gives me some sort of warped pleasure as though I am getting one over on my now departed mother in law. Wife departed as well but not in the same way!  Yes Ivybridge is a fine rugby club and is only about 30 years old. They have come a long way since just having a small shed in a field. The facilities are excellent, the standard of rugby is good, and they have an excellent youth system bringing youngsters through from 7 or 8 years of age and for some it will be a life changer instilling some discipline and keeping them out of trouble. It's not unusual to have 600+ spectators which is bloody good for a small town. Their top of the table status is also being emulated over at Erme Park by the football team, who have an interesting top of the table clash with Bodmin Town at Priory Park coming up next week. Both excellent ways to spend an afternoon locally, and in the summer I also wander up to Ivybridhge Cricket Club (even though I don't really like the game) who also have good facilities and play in a stunning location at Filham Park. I have been to Sandy Park to see The Chiefs and will definitely go again. Excellent atmosphere and big crowds, but for a relaxing afternoon of sporting enjoyment Ivybridge Rugby Club, Ivybridge Football Club, and Ivybridge Cricket Club, are all an excellent choice. It does feel as though we are now, 'proper non-league', with perhaps a mid-table side in the Conference with promotion hopes as far-fetched as they were to Division 3 in the 70s and 80s. This weekend, I was asking myself, just what point is there in being a Torquay fan? It is not entertainment. Is it simply to feel that you earn the right to enjoy the increasingly rare good years? Perhaps in my older age, I am expecting more for my money - with young children, perhaps I am more discerning in acquiring value for money. This weekend, my wife and I went to Wembley to watch the Detroit and Atlanta NFL game. We had Club Wembley tickets, so they were expensive (to me anyway) but it was worth every penny. It was the best sporting event I think I have ever been to, and whilst I was fairly neutral, I was soon rooting for Detroit who clinched victory in dramatic fashion. The experience was exhilarating, intoxicating and left me wanting more. The sense of occasion was immense and on a much smaller scale, Exeter Chiefs tap into a similar sort of vibe. Another sporting event I watched recently was Cullompton v Camborne, in the rugby - real grassroots stuff. Cullompton at Knowle Lane to NFL at Wembley, with TUFC in between. I am starting to understand those people, who pick and choose games to attend as a neutral. If I want proper non-league football, I can go to Exmouth Town and enjoy a pint whilst I watch the game. I can do the same at the rugby and at Wembley for the NFL. Just what do we get at Torquay? It hasn't been awful this year, but it isn't going well at the moment and we are somewhere in between being a League club and the relaxing world of regional football. A sort of nothingness, where the atmosphere is usually flat and people go out of duty. I find it hard to understand people who enjoy going to Plainmoor. For me its about routine and catching up with friends but I rarely look forward to the actual match. That's the dull bit because usually it isn't very good. The experience of the game is generally one that is quite painful, frustrating and boring. This season I committed to a season ticket, against my better judgement. It was the old sentimental, 'loyal supporter' thing to do but I regret it. Committing to watch TUFC for 20 odd Saturdays is preventing me from doing other things I enjoy and if this season falters into nothing, I won't make the same mistake next year. Leisure time is increasingly scarce and precious and I want to enjoy it and being part of something that is exciting (like Chiefs) feels a much better way to spend money and I enjoy the experience more. My sense of duty is all that keeps me going to Plainmoor but that is hanging by a thread. I enjoy the big game atmosphere of the rugby (and the NFL yesterday was something else) and I like the informality of grassroots football and rugby. The level Torquay are at, doesn't really offer either so it is only really any fun when they are winning. That may sound like a fairweather supporter, and I don't really care if it does, but a mediocre, mid-table non-league team is not something I can feel that I want to spend the wages I work hard for on. |
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petef
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Post by petef on Oct 28, 2014 17:54:51 GMT
Link to Chris Hargreaves explanation of Luke Young being at Argyle on Saturday. www.torquayheraldexpress.co.uk/TORQUAY-UNITED-Chris-Hargreaves-defends-Luke/story-23611228-detail/story.htmlPerfectly acceptable in my eyes I have no problem with this at all and cannot understand people getting their knickers in a twist over it and we would have still got beaten and performed poorly if he had been sat on the bench! As long as Luke continues to do the business on the pitch he will have my support and backing. Players like Luke come along rarely to this club. Others may want to drive him out of the club for this heinous crime. Mystified by the reaction of some. |
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Oct 28, 2014 18:59:07 GMT
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Post by bristolgull on Oct 28, 2014 22:46:49 GMT
Link to Chris Hargreaves explanation of Luke Young being at Argyle on Saturday. www.torquayheraldexpress.co.uk/TORQUAY-UNITED-Chris-Hargreaves-defends-Luke/story-23611228-detail/story.htmlPerfectly acceptable in my eyes I have no problem with this at all and cannot understand people getting their knickers in a twist over it and we would have still got beaten and performed poorly if he had been sat on the bench! As long as Luke continues to do the business on the pitch he will have my support and backing. Players like Luke come along rarely to this club. Others may want to drive him out of the club for this heinous crime. Mystified by the reaction of some. Not sure anyone wanted to drive him out Pete, not on this site anyway. Young is our best player and most valuable asset. I did post early Sunday that I was disappointed and upset that young wasn't at the Aldershot game. On reflection I think that was as much about me still feeling frustrated and a little angry about the performance I had just witnessed, I was venting this I guess! Certainly now having had time to reflect and also read CH's explanation, I am a good deal less bothered. |
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sam
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Post by sam on Oct 29, 2014 14:35:44 GMT
Must admit it is better than first reported and like Bristolgull I was feeling pretty cheesed off when I put my comments. I have never known a current player doing such a public thing for another club before. Lets get Wotton up here to do our 50/50. Anyhow, blown over as far as I am concerned and I will not be breaking the 52 year old habit of supporting the Gulls. Fans have different interpretation on things based on their loyalty and experience. It is rare for me, if ever, to criticise and I am glad we know more about how it all came about. Hope all users of forums forgive me for my moment of cynicism.
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petef
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Post by petef on Oct 29, 2014 15:19:19 GMT
If we had won and performed this would never have made it these pages.
Bottom line is he more or less grew up in Plymouth and no doubt has a wealth of friends down there in darkest Cornwall.Players are no different to you or me and always make their own choices The fact he did the draw after being invited to did so after years at the club is no real surprise and he could hardly refuse.
If there was speculation that he was unhappy and wanting a move away and it was done as a publicity stunt then I wouldn't be happy.
If Kevin Nicholson came back here and did he half time draw next week I would applaud him and think nothing more of it and If the manager decides to give his hard working and highly regarded captain a free weekend then hes made that decision for good reasons so lets hope he comes back refreshed and ready to battle.
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Post by stefano on Oct 29, 2014 15:36:34 GMT
Must admit it is better than first reported and like Bristolgull I was feeling pretty cheesed off when I put my comments. I have never known a current player doing such a public thing for another club before. Lets get Wotton up here to do our 50/50. Anyhow, blown over as far as I am concerned and I will not be breaking the 52 year old habit of supporting the Gulls. Fans have different interpretation on things based on their loyalty and experience. It is rare for me, if ever, to criticise and I am glad we know more about how it all came about. Hope all users of forums forgive me for my moment of cynicism. You have got nothing to apologise for. The sad thing for me is the number of long standing supporters and normally sensible posters who do not see a problem with it. It illustrates how tinpot and thoroughly non-league the club has become. I bet the manager, who knew nothing about it, was furious but he has had a good punt at damage limitation (although I have a fair idea who informed him of the comments on the forums and the same person probably scripted his comments!). The captain of Torquay United doing the half time draw at Home Park whilst the club are going out of the FA Cup in the qualifying rounds. Remember those FA Cup games against Tottenham Hotspur, West Ham United, Aston Villa, Newcastle United, Leeds United? They won't be happening again, but could you have imagined John Benson doing the half time draw at Maine Road or Dick Edwards at Villa Park when the club they are captain of is battling it out in the FA Cup? Not a chance in hell! ...and if our long standing supporters have just been lulled into acceptance of such matters through the under achievement and lack of ambition of our club, then in contrast I know exactly what the Argyle supporters thought of it. It was the first thing they were all bursting to tell me on Saturday evening. Not that they had won 3-0, which would be the normal thing, but that our club captain was wined and dined at the Fan Fest and then did the half time draw. I have nothing against Luke Young an excellent player and future League 1 or maybe Championship player, but it was bad judgement whether our supporters care about it or not. If that had been an Argyle captain doing the half time draw at Plainmoor while Argyle were going out of the FA Cup then PASOTI would explode. Still, they are not non-league, are they? |
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hector
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Post by hector on Oct 29, 2014 16:42:24 GMT
For goodness sake, Stefano. There were three choices.
1) Young travels with the team. Incurs the extra cost of an unnecessary overnight stay plus sitting around all day - on a bus and in the ground. Torquay lose and fans are cross about needless expenditure and making our captain sit about all day.
2) Young travels up independently. 3 or 4 hours sat in a car, 3 or 4 hours sat around Aldershot. Drives back independently. A further 3 hours or so sitting about. Torquay lose and fans complain about the captain having to travel up - not good for a player to be sat in a car and in a stand all day. 'What was the point?' they complain.
3) Young is given the day off to get some rest and head space. He chooses to watch his old mates and team, who play not far from his home. Torquay lose and people complain.
Ridiculous over-reaction by so many who should know better. But hey, it's an opportunity to knock Hargreaves or the club, so it must be taken.
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Post by stefano on Oct 29, 2014 20:24:18 GMT
For goodness sake, Stefano. There were three choices. 1) Young travels with the team. Incurs the extra cost of an unnecessary overnight stay plus sitting around all day - on a bus and in the ground. Torquay lose and fans are cross about needless expenditure and making our captain sit about all day. 2) Young travels up independently. 3 or 4 hours sat in a car, 3 or 4 hours sat around Aldershot. Drives back independently. A further 3 hours or so sitting about. Torquay lose and fans complain about the captain having to travel up - not good for a player to be sat in a car and in a stand all day. 'What was the point?' they complain. 3) Young is given the day off to get some rest and head space. He chooses to watch his old mates and team, who play not far from his home. Torquay lose and people complain. Ridiculous over-reaction by so many who should know better. But hey, it's an opportunity to knock Hargreaves or the club, so it must be taken. You are so wide of the mark as to what I think you are not worth anything by way of explanation or further discussion. Hope you have an enjoyable evening. The Apprentice for me in a moment. He'd certainly sort them out sharpish! |
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Oct 29, 2014 22:07:08 GMT
It illustrates how tinpot and thoroughly non-league the club has become. Perception is in the eye of the beholder. For me, there is absolutely nothing "tinpot" about letting our star player rest up when he gets the rare chance. It would be utterly tinpot to force the lad to endure six hours plus cooped up in a car as some kind of punishment beating. For you, it is the other way round. Different strokes for different folks. |
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Post by stefano on Oct 30, 2014 4:43:55 GMT
It illustrates how tinpot and thoroughly non-league the club has become. Perception is in the eye of the beholder. For me, there is absolutely nothing "tinpot" about letting our star player rest up when he gets the rare chance. It would be utterly tinpot to force the lad to endure six hours plus cooped up in a car as some kind of punishment beating. For you, it is the other way round. Different strokes for different folks. Still wide of the mark but never mind. I didn't say where he should have been. I said where he shouldn't have been. My last contribution on this subject as it is flogging a dead horse. Which is probably highly symbolic. |
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Oct 30, 2014 22:35:39 GMT
I didn't say where he should have been. I said where he shouldn't have been. Oh. I am glad you weren't thinking he should have driven up to Aldershot and back - as I have seen somebody suggesting. So is it just that it was Home Park that riles you? Would it have been o.k. if he'd been to Plymouth Albion or Plymouth Parkway? Would he have been o.k. going to Home Park if her hadn't got roped into doing the half-time draw? To my mind banning him from going to Home Park would have been childish and petty - a very tinpot thing to do. He is a professional footballer who is 100% committed to playing for Torquay but has loads of friends at Argyle. So what? It's hardly like finding your wife in bed with the milkman. Just interested in trying to understand what it is you are getting so angry about. Is it just that nobody has invented that time machine that can take you back to 1965? |
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Oct 30, 2014 22:52:26 GMT
I was really hoping that Pearce and Cameron were sensible enough to realise that the way for them to further their careers is to knuckle down, work hard and earn a move upwards. I certainly thought Cameron was doing that - although he has gone off the boil a little recently. I see it has been suggested elsewhere that Cameron has been struggling with hamstring problems - which would certainly explain why he seems to have lost his edge recently. |
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sam
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Post by sam on Oct 31, 2014 10:17:19 GMT
Well there are definitely two camps on the Young issue. My stance is that he should not have been at Argyle doing the half time draw. And I pose the question, can you ever imagine an Argyle player doing the same at Plainmoor. No you can't, it's never happened before and probably never will. The Torquinians have had it easy on this. I live in the South Hams where there is division between Argyle and Torquay support with lots of good humoured banter. Three Argyle supporters have mentioned to me about Young being at Home Park - how was it allowed to happen? - why wasn't he with the team? I understand the situation he found himself in and accept it was 'dropped on his toes' and that it wasn't planned, fine. Unlike Stefano I do think he should have been at Aldershot. Over reaction has been used frequently during this thread but I think the biggest over reaction is posters saying what a trial it would be for Luke Young to travel to faraway Aldershot. Anyone would think it was Brora Rangers he was visiting. Also that he deserved a rest, well he got that from being booked so often. The case for travel and rest is over stated and smacks of clutching at straws. I think Luke is a great player and has been a great signing so no qualms about his ability. On televised football we see injured, dropped or suspended team mates sitting in the stands watching their team play. Think of Frank Lampard being at Stamford Bridge doing the half time draw (or whatever it is they do) while injured - as he is at the moment - while Man City are losing to away to Newcastle or whatever. We all have different viewpoints, it doesn't matter, I respect the views of the people on here. No need for any nastiness. On this issue some staunch loyal supporters think differently and have expressed their thoughts, exactly what a forum is all about.
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Oct 31, 2014 11:16:14 GMT
I think Sam sums my mood up - comments by both sides of the camp. I happen to think he should have been at Aldershot and you can call me Susan if it ain't so.
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