Jon
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Post by Jon on Sept 4, 2011 23:57:12 GMT
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rjdgull
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Post by rjdgull on Sept 5, 2011 6:33:21 GMT
A great bit of research there Jon and the timing could not have been better!
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rjdgull
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Post by rjdgull on Sept 5, 2011 13:18:58 GMT
Interesting to see an A. Bayes in goal as well! But what was Rice doing in defence! ;D
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Sept 5, 2011 22:04:23 GMT
Looking at our line-up, it includes just two players who had played in our last League match (which coincidentally was at home to Brighton) - goalkeeper Archie (not Ashley!) Bayes and South Africa born player manager Percy Mackrill, playing himself out of position at centre-half (sort it out Mackrill!).
Bayes and Townsend both have their initials included whereas the others don't. This isn't to distinguish them from other players of the same name, but to denote their (superior!) amateur status - as was commonly done with cricketers up until the sixties (I think - maybe Barty can confirm?).
Two others - Price and Griffiths had seen first team action that season, whilst Pattison and Thomas would later.
Rice never played for us in the Football League but was a regular during our five years in the Southern League. Pearcey also played for the first team in the Southern League.
That leaves three - Townsend, Gaffney and Alcock with no first team appearances as far as I can tell.
But should this game be counted as a first team game? My first thought is no. It clearly was not the first team fielded and it certainly seems to have been regarded as part of the reserves fixture list for 1927/28 - as seen in the report.
But one of the golden rules of deciding whether a match is a first team game or a reserve team game is that you decide on whether a tournament is first team or reserve and stick to that rather than "pick and choose". We have fielded under-strength teams in the Setanta Shield and the Johnstone's Paint - but they are still first team games. We have played our first team in the Western League and other reserve leagues - but these are still reserve games.
This match was actually the last one of the 1926-27 Southern League. For us, the 1926-27 Southern League was a first team competition. On reflection, maybe this game ought to be added to our list of competitive first team games. Townsend, Gaffney and Alcock ought to be added to our list of first team players.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2011 7:17:55 GMT
Bayes and Townsend both have their initials included whereas the others don't. This isn't to distinguish them from other players of the same name, but to denote their (superior!) amateur status - as was commonly done with cricketers up until the sixties (I think - maybe Barty can confirm?). I’m not sure if this practice ended at the same time but the amateur/professional distinction was abolished in cricket in 1962. Most memorably there was the famous story about Fred Titmus as recounted in his Guardian obituary (by David Frith) earlier this year: “All the while he was a key Middlesex player through season after season, his name having gone down early in cricket's social folklore when, in days when a sensitive division between amateurs and professionals prevailed, a loudspeaker announcement at Lord's informed the purchasers of scorecards that they should amend one entry: "For FJ Titmus please read Titmus, FJ." He was to rise to the captaincy of the county from 1965 to 1968, and could later add MBE to his name.” |
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Mar 3, 2020 0:18:10 GMT
...That leaves three - Townsend, Gaffney and Alcock with no first team appearances as far as I can tell. .... Townsend, Gaffney and Alcock ought to be added to our list of first team players. I did Arthur Townsend a disservice here. He also made a Southern League appearance in 1924/25 that I had incorrectly attributed to his more famous brother Tommy. |
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