Post by Dave on Oct 10, 2008 22:56:17 GMT
Thanks for all you votes and It was good to see harrogategull giving this weeks winner a run for his money.
I'm glad this post has won, because the writer tells it how It really Is and I know merse does not see It the same way, but I'm sure most Of the fans share the views of this weeks winner
Enzo, well done mate
Winning Post
Indeed it was very Important, and to think I was stood next to two 'fans' who were disgusted when the linesman gave that penalty and proceeded to let everybody around them know that "it was the worst thing that could possibly of happened to TUFC"
You see this perfectly illustrates the agenda, vindictiveness and bile that has been directed at Paul Buckle over a concerted period of time from people who simply could not contain their failure to cope with the loss of bragging rights when we lost all at the end of last season and had the insult of Exeter City succeeding instead of us to add to injury.
Led by Dave Shaw on this site and the ridiculous "Bobby" on .net ably assisted by "Brucie", they have all gone remarkably quiet now that the manager has proved he can get the squad playing his way and be successfull into the bargain.
Certain folk are never happy unless they are unhappy (if that makes sense) and I would like to ask those taking Roscoe Dsane to task if they are aware of the precise managerial instructions he was playing to yesterday, and whether they are party to the possible effects he has to cope with EVERY match as a result of the re-constructive surgery to his shoulder in the summer and the even more extensive re-building of his knee just two years ago?
Merse
During the second half of last season and the first month or so of this season Buckle made significant errors - like many Managers have. During this period fans have debated the merits of the Manager, as football fans across the world tend to do. You keep referring back, and seem to genuinely believe, that any anti Buckle stuff is merely the consequence of a group of obviously misguided people who "simply could not contain their failure to cope with the loss of bragging rights when we lost all at the end of last season and had the insult of Exeter City succeeding instead of us to add to injury"
This is not the case, in my opinion. Buckle has deserved to be criticized, in the same way he deserves some credit for our recent run. Fans were critical of Buckle a long time before the City Play Off games. Indeed, I would suggest that the reason why many fans got frustrated is that from January last year we could have predicted what was going to happen. We had been found out and Buckle's tactics were getting very predictable. I could not give a toss that it was Exeter City who beat us - However, I was fuming that our Manager had been found wanting and had made some ridiculous decisions during, and in the run up to, our two most important games of the season. On a related point, criticisms of Buckle this season, for example after the Ebbsfleet game, were not the result of some hangover from our Play off defeat. Torquay fans are used to overcoming disappointment. If that was not the case we'd have all jumped ship years ago. Buckle was critisised because, for whatever reason, we started the season in a shambles. We were hopelessly under prepared, with a Manger who still had no clue what his best team was. Assuming Buckle is completely free to play the players he sees fit, he is the only one who should be held responsible for this and such misguided experiments like Hargreaves at centre back.
In my opinion, the whole discussion on Buckle is dominated by two polarised protagonists who are both living in cloud cuckoo land. On the one hand Mr Shaw, seems unable to credit Buckle for anything positive whilst laying the blame for everything negative solely on his shoulders. At the other end of scale, Merse seems content to credit Buckle with everything under the Sun, whilst refusing to accept that he has any culpability when things go wrong. In reality, Buckle has made a decent fist of his first Managerial post and with the help of the extensive support of the board and considerable back up staff has assembled two decent squads. However, he has also made some glaring and costly errors along the way.
Just as four games was stupidly early to start calling for a Manager's head, it is far too early for people to start lavishing too much praise on Buckle. The difference between success and failure at this level is a fine fine line, and may be the result of conditions completely unrelated to the decisions of the Manager. The bottom line is that a large proportion of the criticism leveled at Bucks was fully justified (in the context of football). Some may have gone too far, but for the most part has been just worried fans venting their frustrations. It may not be productive, but that's football. Lets hope we really have turned the corner - opposition managers will have real trouble trying to predict who and how we are going to play. That has not been the case for some time. For the first times in ages I am looking forward to watching our next game. Very often during the last 6 months watching TUFC has felt like going to work.
You state that you would like to ask fans who critisise players whether they know of the "precise managerial instructions" that a player is playing to. Surely in 99.9% of cases fans will not. Does this render any fans discussion of players as void? In some cases, such as the Play Off first leg even the players did not understand the precise managerial instructions! Tell me, were you actually aware of the precise managerial instructions given to Tim Sills when you questioned his bottle during the Crawley match? I wonder if Sills viewed your comments as "advice" from a "terrace smart arse"?
I'm glad this post has won, because the writer tells it how It really Is and I know merse does not see It the same way, but I'm sure most Of the fans share the views of this weeks winner
Enzo, well done mate
Winning Post
Indeed it was very Important, and to think I was stood next to two 'fans' who were disgusted when the linesman gave that penalty and proceeded to let everybody around them know that "it was the worst thing that could possibly of happened to TUFC"
You see this perfectly illustrates the agenda, vindictiveness and bile that has been directed at Paul Buckle over a concerted period of time from people who simply could not contain their failure to cope with the loss of bragging rights when we lost all at the end of last season and had the insult of Exeter City succeeding instead of us to add to injury.Led by Dave Shaw on this site and the ridiculous "Bobby" on .net ably assisted by "Brucie", they have all gone remarkably quiet now that the manager has proved he can get the squad playing his way and be successfull into the bargain.
Certain folk are never happy unless they are unhappy (if that makes sense) and I would like to ask those taking Roscoe Dsane to task if they are aware of the precise managerial instructions he was playing to yesterday, and whether they are party to the possible effects he has to cope with EVERY match as a result of the re-constructive surgery to his shoulder in the summer and the even more extensive re-building of his knee just two years ago?
Merse
During the second half of last season and the first month or so of this season Buckle made significant errors - like many Managers have. During this period fans have debated the merits of the Manager, as football fans across the world tend to do. You keep referring back, and seem to genuinely believe, that any anti Buckle stuff is merely the consequence of a group of obviously misguided people who "simply could not contain their failure to cope with the loss of bragging rights when we lost all at the end of last season and had the insult of Exeter City succeeding instead of us to add to injury"
This is not the case, in my opinion. Buckle has deserved to be criticized, in the same way he deserves some credit for our recent run. Fans were critical of Buckle a long time before the City Play Off games. Indeed, I would suggest that the reason why many fans got frustrated is that from January last year we could have predicted what was going to happen. We had been found out and Buckle's tactics were getting very predictable. I could not give a toss that it was Exeter City who beat us - However, I was fuming that our Manager had been found wanting and had made some ridiculous decisions during, and in the run up to, our two most important games of the season. On a related point, criticisms of Buckle this season, for example after the Ebbsfleet game, were not the result of some hangover from our Play off defeat. Torquay fans are used to overcoming disappointment. If that was not the case we'd have all jumped ship years ago. Buckle was critisised because, for whatever reason, we started the season in a shambles. We were hopelessly under prepared, with a Manger who still had no clue what his best team was. Assuming Buckle is completely free to play the players he sees fit, he is the only one who should be held responsible for this and such misguided experiments like Hargreaves at centre back.
In my opinion, the whole discussion on Buckle is dominated by two polarised protagonists who are both living in cloud cuckoo land. On the one hand Mr Shaw, seems unable to credit Buckle for anything positive whilst laying the blame for everything negative solely on his shoulders. At the other end of scale, Merse seems content to credit Buckle with everything under the Sun, whilst refusing to accept that he has any culpability when things go wrong. In reality, Buckle has made a decent fist of his first Managerial post and with the help of the extensive support of the board and considerable back up staff has assembled two decent squads. However, he has also made some glaring and costly errors along the way.
Just as four games was stupidly early to start calling for a Manager's head, it is far too early for people to start lavishing too much praise on Buckle. The difference between success and failure at this level is a fine fine line, and may be the result of conditions completely unrelated to the decisions of the Manager. The bottom line is that a large proportion of the criticism leveled at Bucks was fully justified (in the context of football). Some may have gone too far, but for the most part has been just worried fans venting their frustrations. It may not be productive, but that's football. Lets hope we really have turned the corner - opposition managers will have real trouble trying to predict who and how we are going to play. That has not been the case for some time. For the first times in ages I am looking forward to watching our next game. Very often during the last 6 months watching TUFC has felt like going to work.
You state that you would like to ask fans who critisise players whether they know of the "precise managerial instructions" that a player is playing to. Surely in 99.9% of cases fans will not. Does this render any fans discussion of players as void? In some cases, such as the Play Off first leg even the players did not understand the precise managerial instructions! Tell me, were you actually aware of the precise managerial instructions given to Tim Sills when you questioned his bottle during the Crawley match? I wonder if Sills viewed your comments as "advice" from a "terrace smart arse"?