Dave
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Post by Dave on Dec 28, 2008 23:34:23 GMT
This post is not aimed at young fans, it has been written because of two young fans I witnessed after the game today. There could have been the same reaction from much older fans, I do know those shouting at Carlisle and Nico today, were certainly not our young fans.
I simply could not believe how angry they were, as they started leaving the ground, no we did not win today and we can't expect to win every game. There are ways that games are lost, that might explain fans leaving in an angry mood, but todays game was not one of them.
Maybe for me it really is an age thing, no matter what people may say about those of us who have been around a bit longer there are some things that can't be denied. One such fact is, that we really have seen and one would hope have learned a lot more than very young people. Only because we have had todate, so many more experiences, that younger people could not be expected to have had so far, in their shorter lives.
So is that the reason I was able to walk away happy today? well my team lost the game today, so did the team of those young fans, yet I was fine about it, but they were not. I could claim that I was OK about it, as I have been here before, so many times as a TUFC fan. So many times expecting, only to see it all fade into nothing and with nothing at the end of it all.
So has age made me learn not to expect too much? taught me there will be times when things won't happen the way I want them too. Times when I will still get disappointed, but know its not the end of the world and there will be better times still too come.
What I also know is, that it is still and always will be only a game, no lives depend on the results of my football team, the world will still turn if my team loses a game and the stars will still come out at night. I'm sure some poor cats have been kicked by some angry fan, who came home from a game after his team lost. I'm sure some have even gone and got drunk, because the pain of defeat was too much to bare.
It still will be a game, yes its a very passionate game at times, but as long as the team give everything they have, then fans need to see that and not let the fact that the team lost, blind them from what really happened. I do also feel that with the world as it is at this time. the credit crunch, fear of losing jobs etc, that some will see football as an escape. The problem with that is, defeat will only add to the doom and gloom some will be feeling.
Its far better to go to games and hope to watch a good team performance and say to yourself that winning will be a bonus, then defeat may not be so hard to take for some.
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Post by ohtobeatplainmoor on Dec 28, 2008 23:46:54 GMT
I find defeat hard to enjoy as such, but as I have said on this site elsewhere, I thought that generally we played well today and will win far more than we will lose with this team.
I felt that they were worth the entrance fee today and know that they will be busting a gut on the training ground to keep progressing.
I hear idiots on a weekly basis who have clearly gorged themselves on Sky and have lost persective on what players at BSP level are capable of. There are some people there old enough to know better, but sadly their vocal critisism of individual players within earshot is cearly heard by those players and does nothing to help our cause.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2008 0:32:52 GMT
I hear idiots on a weekly basis who have clearly gorged themselves on Sky and have lost persective on what players at BSP level are capable of. Lots of truth in that statement. I believe it's also linked to the tendency to over-analyse everything to do with football. We're all pundits now, aren't we? Fair play to TV for raising awareness of the tactical side of the game, but I wonder if it's led to an over-demanding audience which expects blackboard perfection? And there always seems to be a lot more to be said about the bad things, doesn't there? We can win well against good oppostion and what are the talking points? X played crap, Y should have been substituted, we should have had two more and the referee (as they always are) was hopeless and biased against us. Ah well.... Yes, the Kidderminster match was a difficult one to assess. I thought we were excellent during the opening spell but, as the game wore on, I felt Kidderminster were defending well -weren't we linked with the keeper when he was leaving Blyth Spartans in the summer? Kidderminster scored when they'd weathered most of the storm - always a fine time to do so - but, had we'd scored after 25/30 minutes, I wonder what Kidderminster would have been like chasing the game? But we didn't do so. C'est la vie. One of those occasions, maybe, when it's more difficult than normal to gather - and express - your thoughts at the final whistle. I too heard plenty of negativity coming out of the ground and, to be honest, it took me to the corner of Springfield Road before I was showing much postivity myself (partly because I couldn't help reflecting on the similarities with the recent Cambridge match). But, as other posters have said, most players (but not all) performed well and more of the same will win us plenty of games. Hopefully there'll be others feeling more upbeat after reflection. It's also an opportunity to remember that there are some sports -rugby and basketball amongst them - where the team that has the territory, and plays better than their opponent, nearly always wins. But that's not football, is it? It happens... |
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petef
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Post by petef on Dec 29, 2008 15:22:42 GMT
I am afraid these are the fickle people who eventually will walk away when the going gets tough and incidentaly not all are youngsters.
They are what we used to call glory hunters who only turn up for the good times, support ANY winning team and cannot stick with it for the bad- and we are not even having a bad time - far from it.
When you look back at our recent run of only TWO league defeats since the beginning of September it just make you wonder what planet these people are on and when there is a run of poor results these are the few hundred fans that go missing.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Dec 29, 2008 15:30:38 GMT
As I said Pete it was not an attack on young fans, as I'm sure there are plenty of older fans who walked away moaning after the game, just they were the ones who walked out near me.
You make the good point that we have only lost two games since the beginning of September and It makes you wonder if people have just forgot what a defeat tastes like. There was nothing to really moan about yesterday, maybe we could just be a tad unhappy at our inability to score, but it was not due to a lack of trying or hard work.
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nigep
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Post by nigep on Dec 29, 2008 18:06:16 GMT
I was angry yesterday. Not at the players, it was just one of those days. I was angry at some of the vitriol aimed at Wayne Carlisle. I know he had a poor game but I thought Danny Stevens was worse. Danny saw much more of the ball and subsequently had much more opportunity to influence the game but he didn't. In the second half, Carlisle was miles away from a hopeful punt down the line and he was criticised for not reaching it. Usain Bolt would not have got anywhere near it.
In fact the wide players were so disappointing, I was hoping that Bucks would have gambled with Benyon and Green either side of Tim Sills for the last 20 mins.
Talking of Tim Sills, I was annoyed that I waited around, freezing my nuts off, to applaud the players and he dashed off down the tunnel like a spoilt kid at the end of the game.
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Post by chrish on Dec 29, 2008 20:13:03 GMT
The young fans that stood near us were fairly positive, it was the old knobheads that really stood out with the negative comments. There's two who stand by the halfway line on the popside just behind the back crush barrier and just moaned the whole game. Carlisle copped for it in a big way. It seems that to avoid critiscism from the dense version of Stadtler and Waldorf, Carlisle should be able to run 50 yards in 2 seconds, take on and beat 2 players every time he gets the ball. The amount of times I heard chief manure for brains shout out "f**k off back to Exeter, Carlisle" was amazing.
I'm 100% sure that if Wayne joined us from any other club than Exeter he wouldn't get so much abuse (compare it with Rice last year), when in their book players like Stevens seem to enjoy almost endless levels of tolerance not matter how poor they might play. Personally speaking, I'd rather have another Carlisle type of player on the left , rather than go for the lightweight option of Carayol or Stevens.
I applauded them off the pitch yesterday. They all put in a huge effort and on another day we could've won by several goals.
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Dec 29, 2008 20:23:25 GMT
I have a funny feeling Chris that we are talking about the same two, as that is where they came from. Still one day they will understand the game better and maybe learn that shouting abuse to players, does not help in anyway, or get them to play any better.
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Post by forevertufc on Dec 29, 2008 20:47:15 GMT
what disturb's me is the fact that its mainly older fans who are guilty of shouting abuse at the players ,and they should know better.
shouting abuse upsets some players and other end up trying to hard to get the fans back onside,what it results in the case of all players is their performance level drops period.
in the case of danny stevens he could not pass the ball 2yards yesterday ,and the groans from fans realy did not help you could see his confidence just draining away,in the end he just turned around and got rid of the ball as fast as he could ,rather than taking on his man as normal.
as for wayne carlisle this is realy getting my goat now,i dont quite know what he has to do,before his injury he was getting better match by match and was fast becoming a major part of our team,what some dont have the brains to realise is torquay do not have the luxury of a reserve team ,to help players with injury recovery ,yes his passing and crossing lacked quality at times yesterday that will come with playing match's not sat in the stands with his jeans on,a fully fit performing well wayne carlisle is the type of player who will help us back to league 2 .
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Dec 29, 2008 20:57:08 GMT
forevertufc as I said my post was not aimed at young fans, I would think they are out numbered by older moaning fans, I just could not understand the real anger, that was clear to see from the two young fans who walked out near me. When I say anger, they were not shouting out anything as such, but their faces and expressions were very angry indeed.
It has been the case that some will defend their right to shout out what they like at football matches, they will argue that they paid to watch and therefore that has given them the right.I think we have all been guilty at one time or another for the same, that is why I wondered for me, if now I was older I have just sort of grown out of it all. It may be the case as I suspect, that I just understand the game and how things will be, at a club such as ours much better now.
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Post by forevertufc on Dec 29, 2008 21:31:37 GMT
forevertufc as I said my post was not aimed at young fans, I would think they are out numbered by older moaning fans, I just could not understand the real anger, that was clear to see from the two young fans who walked out near me. When I say anger, they were not shouting out anything as such, but their faces and expressions were very angry indeed. It has been the case that some will defend their right to shout out what they like at football matches, they will argue that they paid to watch and therefore that has given them the right.I think we have all been guilty at one time or another for the same, that is why I wondered for me, if now I was older I have just sort of grown out of it all. It may be the case as I suspect, that I just understand the game and how things will be, at a club such as ours much better now. i know your not having a go at the younger fans ,and i do get where your coming from,i can not tell why peole felt the need to be angry ,myself and the lads i meet up with are all in our late 30's early 40's we stood in boots/laces after the game not angry ,just gutted because we had lost a game we all know should have been won,also every one of us agreed the team performance was good maybe lacked a bit of quality ,effort wise the team could not have done more to win that game. as much as some of us hate it football club's are now a business, as fans we are looked at as paying customers and maybe we are thinking that way to. if the team performance has not reached the expected level then some fans will feel thet have not received the service they have paid for ,do they have the right to complain ? looking at it that way yes. however as any down to earth football fan knows .football is not a service industry and in my view should not be treated as such,if any fan feel's the need to complain/shout abuse , during the game is not the right time ,it only makes performance levels drop . this bit i aim at fans in general ,as fans do we think footballers dont hurt ,do we think that footballers need to be told when things have not gone right ,they do hurt ,and if they dont know they had a bad game they soon will when the boss gets hold of them in the dressing room,from fans they need our support and nothing else. |
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Dave
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Post by Dave on Dec 29, 2008 21:42:25 GMT
forevertufc, you say that football is not a service industry, I agree to a point, but for some it will be seen as an entertainment type service that is being offered. I do think that we are often just seem as paying customers and as such I do believe we have the right to moan, if we feel we have not got what we paid for, but just what are we really paying for anyway.
The time to moan is on the way home maybe, or even on a forum and I fully agree that a player knows when his game is poor, we do nothing to help by shouting it out to him.At the end of the day it really comes down to being a very passionate sport at times and we all are different and show our emotions in so many different ways.
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Post by atheringtongull on Dec 30, 2008 19:21:11 GMT
I haven't made a post for sometime now, mainly because I get fed up with a certain person who lives in London constantly criticizing other people's comments.
However, I would like to say those shouting abuse at Carlisle, Green and Stevens were standing right behind me, leaning on the rail as they always do. They were not youngsters, I would guess they were of pensionable age, like me. Whatever I said about our early season performances, (and at the time I felt that myself and several others were right to say what we did), there is no doubt that to only lose 2 games in 18(?) is a pretty good record, but to listen to those behind me on Sunday, I could have punched them in the face, (and I'm an easy going bloke who wouldn't say boo to a goose). They are like it virtually every game, I don't know why they bother to come. They've been having a go at Nicholson as well for several weeks now. For them every corner or free kick is a total disaster. There are some around me who are constantly on at Dsane as well. I know he often gives the appearance of being a bit lazy and slowly wanders back to get onside after attacking play, but like Carlisle he has a knack of getting into the penalty area at crucial times. And lets face it, I don't think he was playing in either of those 2 defeats.
Sunday was definitely a game of "if onlys". If only Green had scored after a minute, if only Carlisle's header had been better etc etc,and if only their goalie hadn't saved the penalty.
I'm not surprised Sills ran off at the end, he must have been as sick as a dog. Probably feeling he didn't deserve any applause.
I was feeling pretty contented as I drove my 60 miles back to N Devon in spite of us losing, as I felt we had played pretty well and didn't deserve to lose. Not like early in the season when I drove home in dark depression wondering why I was stupid enough to travel all that way to see such rubbish! (and in spite of what Merse might say, rubbish it was!)
So no doubt, unless we thrash Blackpool 3 -1 or something similar, for those sickies behind me won't be satisfied. As for me, if we play as well as we can, even if we lose, I'll be pretty satisfied. Who knows, with a bit of luck anything can happen.
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Post by chrish on Dec 30, 2008 20:10:41 GMT
AtheringtonGull and DaveR,
I think we're talking about the same blokes here. One constantly shouts "come on" every 5 seconds and the other one is his sounding board for his dubious theories. One of them being "Danny Stevens is a warm weather player".
The best comment I heard on Sunday was this bloke screaming at Carlisle to support Tim Sills. It must've been Stevie Wonder because Carlisle was already about 5 metres away from Sills and in a position to receive a simple pass. I had to make a small comment saying "he's already there, you feckin' eedjit".
If Carlisle has another poor game I shall search every fecker on the popside to see who's got the Kryptonite!! Otherwise I'll happily conceed thats he's not using his superhuman powers and I'll deride him as a lazy bastard who should feck off back to Exeter, and he's Irish as well. How can he beat a couple of men and produce a pinpoint cross whilst wearing tweed, a pig under one arm and a sack of potatoes under the other arm?
Moaning bastards at home to Kidderminster and a troupe of alcoholic santas at Weymouth. Whats gonna be next? Shall I punch one and you punch the other one AtheringtonGull?
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merse
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Post by merse on Dec 30, 2008 20:47:29 GMT
I haven't made a post for sometime now, mainly because I get fed up with a certain person who lives in London constantly criticizing other people's comments.  My heart bleeds for you Atherington, as for constantly criticising other people's comments; a quick survey of my last ten postings (click on my name then select from my profile "last 10 postings") will show that far from "constantly" criticising other posters; only Two of those last ten (20%) postings could be classed in that category..............and those in response to totally inaccurate and irrelevent insinuations thrown at me in posts that totally ignored the cusp of what I had posted. I would say two more (another 20%) contained constructive alternative views in response to a thread's view.....................so really you are talking bollocks here aren't you! Or am I misconstruing your "certain person who lives in London" ? If so ,"sorry your maj"  Still, looking on the bright side of life I seem to have been elevated from the ranks of "The likes Of" to merely "Merse". Do I sense love in the air?  |
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