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Post by crownhil on Sept 11, 2018 10:42:12 GMT
I/m not sure if this is on the correct thread but here goes.I am the ex chairman of tufc.I think its time I put a few facts on the issues that are currently surrounding the club.Firstly the idea that we the previous directors were dangling the carrot of the freehold of Plainmoorto possible owners is nonsense.It wasn't ours to dangle.It was made very clear that we didn't hold the freehold and any negotiations would be between them and Torbay Council. The club actually pay a reasonable rent to the local authority.As far is the TUST is concernedI was personally a member for many yrears. When I was approached by Stephen Breed to form part of a fans consortium. I informed him that I was more inclined to go along the TUST route. Unfortunately in the harsh world of pro football,CASH IS KING.Initially there were 10 people who were going to invest 30k intoTUFC in May 2015, this quickly disintigrated into just 4 of us.This was going to be unsustainable.
If our heads ruled our hearts we would have pulled out but we soldiered on.
I spent the next 18 months at the club trying to get new investors in, we realised we were only a plug to fill the hole on a temporary basis.
If you recall Thea Bristow paid a considerable sum to Kelvin Thomas to find new owners, after many attempts and 6 months of trying the quest failed.
we now arrived at May 2015 when it looked like the club would fold.
myself and the other directors were to put further sums into the club to keep it afloat.
indeed the money was swallowed up with the signings of the likes of Blisset and Racchi etc.
These signings in no small way led to the first GREAT ESCAPE.
It has been well documented that we were just 24 hours from administration in Dec 2016, the administrators were actually in our boardroom to sign the documents.
In administration there is no guarantee that any new investors would come forward.
We the directors were advised by our legal team that the best solution to avoid admin was to hand the club to GI, who had already put substantial loans into the club.
This route meant also that we 4 directors would lose our investments, up to 50k,
However we managed to hold the fort together for over 18 months.
Finally , personally I have been a fan for over 60 years and actually played for the reserves( 1 game in Don Mills time).
I bleed gold and blue.
I love this club and find it hard to see us in our present position .
I am easy to talk to and welcome anyone speaking to me about anything about the club.
I finf it both offensive and hurtful that that anyone should accuse me of signing the death warrant of my beloved TUFC.
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petef
Match Room Manager 
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Post by petef on Sept 11, 2018 12:45:23 GMT
I/m not sure if this is on the correct thread but here goes.I am the ex chairman of tufc.I think its time I put a few facts on the issues that are currently surrounding the club.Firstly the idea that we the previous directors were dangling the carrot of the freehold of Plainmoorto possible owners is nonsense.It wasn't ours to dangle.It was made very clear that we didn't hold the freehold and any negotiations would be between them and Torbay Council. The club actually pay a reasonable rent to the local authority.As far is the TUST is concernedI was personally a member for many yrears. When I was approached by Stephen Breed to form part of a fans consortium. I informed him that I was more inclined to go along the TUST route. Unfortunately in the harsh world of pro football,CASH IS KING.Initially there were 10 people who were going to invest 30k intoTUFC in May 2015, this quickly disintigrated into just 4 of us.This was going to be unsustainable. If our heads ruled our hearts we would have pulled out but we soldiered on. I spent the next 18 months at the club trying to get new investors in, we realised we were only a plug to fill the hole on a temporary basis. If you recall Thea Bristow paid a considerable sum to Kelvin Thomas to find new owners, after many attempts and 6 months of trying the quest failed. we now arrived at May 2015 when it looked like the club would fold. myself and the other directors were to put further sums into the club to keep it afloat. indeed the money was swallowed up with the signings of the likes of Blisset and Racchi etc. These signings in no small way led to the first GREAT ESCAPE. It has been well documented that we were just 24 hours from administration in Dec 2016, the administrators were actually in our boardroom to sign the documents. In administration there is no guarantee that any new investors would come forward. We the directors were advised by our legal team that the best solution to avoid admin was to hand the club to GI, who had already put substantial loans into the club. This route meant also that we 4 directors would lose our investments, up to 50k, However we managed to hold the fort together for over 18 months. Finally , personally I have been a fan for over 60 years and actually played for the reserves( 1 game in Don Mills time). I bleed gold and blue. I love this club and find it hard to see us in our present position . I am easy to talk to and welcome anyone speaking to me about anything about the club. I finf it both offensive and hurtful that that anyone should accuse me of signing the death warrant of my beloved TUFC. Thank you for the open and informative post DP. I have great sympathy with your position on this but you must have realised you were on a hiding to nothing in the eyes of a minority of supporters. Steve Breed had the right idea detach yourself completely after all of the unreasonable and insulting criticism he took at the time. Whatever sum you invested or however hard you tried it would never be enough and as the main man in the front line at the time you had to take all of the criticism, 99% of it totally unreasonable. We should all be thanking you for keeping the club afloat when no one else was faintly interested in taking on a seemingly impossible task. And yes I believe everything you did was for the love of the football club and if you hadn't intervened we wouldn't be discussing any future TUFC on here. How many of us would have put £50k in to what seemed like a lost cause never to be recouped? Its easy to take a swipe at previous failures from the comfort of a keyboard but that's the problem with social media whilst informative and full of information much of it is unfounded rumor that many pick up on and regard as gospel. Flippant and hurtful comments with little thought of how it may effect a person. Its common these days and sadly rife in schools. Its good to see you posting here. This is one site where posters, in the main respects others views and usually offers reasoned and fair argument with out all of the childish playground name calling that persists on others. Unfortunately TUFC has gradually become a victim of it past history and we all expect success and a reverse in fortunes that will see us return to the football league. I don't think it will ever happen now the ship has sailed. Viable and well supported when supported well and successful in the football league when footballers earned a normal working mans wage and played for the love of it. The modern game even at our lowly level still needs massive investment to survive and to even sustain what we now have to bare. Sadly I believe were not far off a tipping point once more with an costly football league ground and infrastructure that will eventually bankrupt the club once the current owner / chairman wants out. |
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Sept 11, 2018 12:55:04 GMT
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Jon
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Post by Jon on Sept 11, 2018 12:57:46 GMT
I am easy to talk to and welcome anyone speaking to me about anything about the club. I find it both offensive and hurtful that that anyone should accuse me of signing the death warrant of my beloved TUFC. Are you at the Youth Cup game this evening, Dave? I would be more than happy to discuss with you in person. Rest assured, I would never say anything about anyone on a forum that I was not absolutely prepared to say to their face. P.S. I have moved this to a new thread. |
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Sept 11, 2018 13:20:02 GMT
“As far is the TUST is concernedI was personally a member for many yrears. When I was approached by Stephen Breed to form part of a fans consortium. I informed him that I was more inclined to go along the TUST route. Unfortunately in the harsh world of pro football, CASH IS KING. Initially there were 10 people who were going to invest 30k into TUFC in May 2015, this quickly disintigrated into just 4 of us”.
Small point, Dave. Was it not possible to revisit your first inclination at that stage. And if not, why was that and why was their assistance not sought at that stage, if it wasn’t?
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Post by loyalgull on Sept 11, 2018 13:47:27 GMT
Its only a matter time before the plug is pulled on us now so not even worth discussing now anymore.A cruel end to a once great club desperate sorrow for the fans at times this club hasnt deserved them and now its tragic.osborne has never built a stadium of any note and doesnt like football so we know why he is here god help us
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Sept 11, 2018 14:21:10 GMT
“As far is the TUST is concernedI was personally a member for many yrears. When I was approached by Stephen Breed to form part of a fans consortium. I informed him that I was more inclined to go along the TUST route. Unfortunately in the harsh world of pro football, CASH IS KING. Initially there were 10 people who were going to invest 30k into TUFC in May 2015, this quickly disintigrated into just 4 of us”. Small point, Dave. Was it not possible to revisit your first inclination at that stage. And if not, why was that and why was their assistance not sought at that stage, if it wasn’t? I think David's statement 'CASH IS KING' answers that, Rob. TUST didn't have any cash, or the means to raise any substantial amount, so as a possible option at the time it would have been dismissed. I appreciate that is your view, Flo. If Dave could confirm that is how it pannned out for him when those others pulled out, I’d be interested to know. Certainly would be interested as to whether the question (of assistance) was asked as maybe 400 pulling in the same direction at that point could have aided cash flow and put off the need for a loan from a property developer, for example? Others within the boardroom may have rejected the need to ask TUST - considered and dismissed as Flo puts it. Or someone may have considered a GI loan the best bet of any/if any other options than TUST available. He may have personally asked and been told ‘we haven’t got a pot to piss in’. I genuinely don’t know and won’t assume what his response might be. I’m interested to know if Dave feels able or inclined to shed light. If not, I would respect that also, as we are where we currently are and the past may be something Dave does not want to go over in more detail than his post today. |
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petef
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Post by petef on Sept 11, 2018 16:32:14 GMT
"White Elephant" and old expression that just about sums it all up.
A white elephant is a possession which its owner cannot dispose of and whose cost, particularly that of maintenance, is out of proportion to its usefulness. In modern usage, it is an object, building project, scheme, business venture, facility, etc., considered expensive but without use or value.
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Sept 11, 2018 16:47:16 GMT
To be fair, Flo, the club hasn’t exactly been taken forward since, has it. Ownership transferred to a property developer in default of a loan and at our lowest League position since 1927 were the upshot. But Dave’s take is what I’m keen on. We didn’t live what he was living at that time, other than seeing our club’s decline.
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Post by plainmoorpete on Sept 11, 2018 16:50:00 GMT
Roughly two years ago, in response to allegations that TUST did not have the financial reserves to either purchase or fund the club, it asked its members to pledge £100 each to be held in a special fund to be saved until the occasion arised when it would be needed.
Of 400 plus members only 19 responded. A lot of people are prepared to point the finger but when push comes to shove its easier for them to tell other people how to spend their money.
This club was living on borrowed time when DP and co stepped in, it was back on death row when Osbourne stepped in, although he no saviour.
Simple fact is once Bateson got tired of running the club this was always likely to be the outcome.
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Rob
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Post by Rob on Sept 11, 2018 17:00:10 GMT
Pete - They weren’t being asked by an ownership in need at that time as far as I am aware. Certainly those 19 weren’t aware of a desperate immediate need. And neither were the 380+ others and more who may have perhaps rallied. If the Club was asking TUST to assist and people such as Flo and myself were aware that was the case, that would have attracted both of us to dip in. We know that from this thread already. I’m asking something different.
My recollection, and it will be different to a horses mouth account, was that all was in hand if we got a break-even crowd figure, which we surpassed. And then we heard about the GI loan, were told they weren’t to be our ‘best of bedfellows’ and then, the loan was called in by GI.
Dave - and I keep being informal - can assist with this as he lived through something other than TUFC just being shit on the pitch. Something which we’ve got shitter at since.
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chelstongull
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Post by chelstongull on Sept 11, 2018 17:43:53 GMT
Pete - They weren’t being asked by an ownership in need at that time as far as I am aware. Certainly those 19 weren’t aware of a desperate immediate need. And neither were the 380+ others and more who may have perhaps rallied. If the Club was asking TUST to assist and people such as Flo and myself were aware that was the case, that would have attracted both of us to dip in. We know that from this thread already. I’m asking something different. My recollection, and it will be different to a horses mouth account, was that all was in hand if we got a break-even crowd figure, which we surpassed. And then we heard about the GI loan, were told they weren’t to be our ‘best of bedfellows’ and then, the loan was called in by GI. Dave - and I keep being informal - can assist with this as he lived through something other than TUFC just being shit on the pitch. Something which we’ve got shitter at since. There are so many questions that need to be asked and the middle paragraph one is what I would to hear the reasoning behind. What other options were there and was the very worst one of the lot to sell to a property developer with a known background of not building stadia. Surely a bit of search on google would have told folk what was what? |
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Post by loyalgull on Sept 11, 2018 17:59:39 GMT
Pete - They weren’t being asked by an ownership in need at that time as far as I am aware. Certainly those 19 weren’t aware of a desperate immediate need. And neither were the 380+ others and more who may have perhaps rallied. If the Club was asking TUST to assist and people such as Flo and myself were aware that was the case, that would have attracted both of us to dip in. We know that from this thread already. I’m asking something different. My recollection, and it will be different to a horses mouth account, was that all was in hand if we got a break-even crowd figure, which we surpassed. And then we heard about the GI loan, were told they weren’t to be our ‘best of bedfellows’ and then, the loan was called in by GI. Dave - and I keep being informal - can assist with this as he lived through something other than TUFC just being shit on the pitch. Something which we’ve got shitter at since. There are so many questions that need to be asked and the middle paragraph one is what I would to hear the reasoning behind. What other options were there and was the very worst one of the lot to sell to a property developer with a known background of not building stadia. Surely a bit of search on google would have told folk what was what? And dave phillips flatly denied it was gi taking over but guess what.Break even crowds were 1800 and for quite a while they held up but form dipped so did the gates under nicholsons tenure.And when he announced gi a new dawm he said gi got some fantastic plans for the club a brilliant 5 year plan new stadium.As of now its the worst in our history.And set to get a whole lot worse |
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Post by plainmoorpete on Sept 11, 2018 19:32:16 GMT
Speaking from memory only, I think the 1800 break even figure was announced before Kevin Nicholson took over and before the loan was taken from GI.
The loan was taken out to give Nicholson money to strengthen the squad to avoid relegation which Philips thought would be the end of the club.
A higher break even figure was set for the following season (@2300 I think) although the cut price season tickets didn't help.
It's possible 1800 was realistic providing the loan hadn't been taken out but would likely have resulted in an earlier relegation.
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hector
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Post by hector on Sept 11, 2018 20:56:15 GMT
“As far is the TUST is concernedI was personally a member for many yrears. When I was approached by Stephen Breed to form part of a fans consortium. I informed him that I was more inclined to go along the TUST route. Unfortunately in the harsh world of pro football, CASH IS KING. Initially there were 10 people who were going to invest 30k into TUFC in May 2015, this quickly disintigrated into just 4 of us”. Small point, Dave. Was it not possible to revisit your first inclination at that stage. And if not, why was that and why was their assistance not sought at that stage, if it wasn’t? I think David's statement 'CASH IS KING' answers that, Rob. TUST didn't have any cash, or the means to raise any substantial amount, so as a possible option at the time it would have been dismissed. TUST was never given the opportunity to launch a serious f7ndraising campaign to buy the club. They were strung along, with Peter Masters playing the tune in the background. |
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