merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
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Post by merse on Oct 5, 2010 22:43:14 GMT
 I'm sure many of you of my generation who knew Mike Poblocki as a very talented South Devon footballer in the sixties and seventies would have been horrified and saddened at his plight as reported in the Herald Express today. I've read a few distasteful and off hand dismissals of alcoholics as wasters and authors of their own demise on these boards over the time the TFF has been in existence, but I would urge any of you who detect that anyone at all who matters to you is hitting the alcohol a bit too heavily to get in there quick and try to do something to help them. When you get to Michael's time of life and you are that far down the road to Skid Row it is far too late and certainly not the time for some dick head of a magistrate to be serving him an ASBO!  What the feck does a so called intelligent and socially responsible person think that an ASBO will mean to the non existent reasoning of a very sick and destitute person who's brain has been addled by the toxins produced by a diseased liver? I thought you had to have some sort of education to sit on the Bench in this day and age?
"Psychotic tendencies" instigated by alcohol or drug abuse are a mental illness , and as such the purveyor of these tendencies (however unpleasant, threatening and anti social a character they might have become) have a basic human right to be treated with responsibility and compassion by society..........."threatening" this poor guy with prison is in fact doing him a favour when he is living rough in public toilets surely! I've read somewhere that by far the majority of "street dwellers" or homeless people living rough to you and I, are suffering from types of psychotic or delusionary disorders ~ it is an uncaring and heartless society that walks by on the other side and ignores their plight. I've told on here before how I have had personal experience of living with someone who's young life was brought to a premature end through alcohol dependency and of the devastating "pack of cards" effect that had on the family of that young person. If there is anyone reading this who can take a professional or proactive step to ensure that Michael gets the very real help that he needs, I am sure I will not be the only one on here who would appreciate that. Michael Poblocki's plight could have been that of any one of us.
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Post by stefano on Oct 6, 2010 7:32:00 GMT
I'm sure many of you of my generation who knew Mike Poblocki as a very talented South Devon footballer in the sixties and seventies would have been horrified and saddened at his plight as reported in the Herald Express today................................................................................................Michael Poblocki's plight could have been that of any one of us. What a very sad story Merse which draws attention through someone we knew to the plight of thousands of people in this country and millions across the world. According to the Mental Health Charity MIND one in four of us suffers from a type of mental illness, which is a quite worrying statistic in it's own right. These health problems are often described as depression, panic attacks, or anxiety, so are often not seen by many as a form of mental illness. Many, in fact most, people with a mental illness can carry on leading productive lives with a little help from family and friends. Mike and others like him present more of a problem and normally end up in the Criminal Justice System even though this is designed for punishment / rehabilitation rather than the treatment of the underlying causes of the offences committed. Although the closure of many specialist hospitals to be replaced by community based mental health and social care was described by the politicians at the time (in the 1990's) as doing away with 'Victorian asylums' so that people with mental health problems could receive 'care in the community', the specialist hospitals (such as the excellent and well respected Moorhaven Hospital just outside of Ivybridge) were not 'Victorian' in their approach and I believe they have been badly missed. Care in the community is probably an ideal but not achievable in many situations, particularly where there is no support network of family and friends. Mental illness is undoubtedly the least understood of all medical conditions not only by the community at large but also by health professionals, and people can be caught in a situation where each department that could provide some assistance has reasons for not getting involved. I would have thought referral by his GP to the Community Mental Health Team would be the best course, but does Mike ever go to a GP or has he even got one? Getting him off the streets should be the obvious objective, but not straightforward if there are a lack of suitable places since the closure of specialist hospitals and a lack of co-operation partly induced by alcoholism. In happier times for Mike I worked with him at Centrax. He was a talented and tricky right winger and I remember him playing for Newton Dynamoes when they were one of the leading South Devon League teams before their elevation to the South western League. I picked Mike up a couple of times in the late 60's on my Lambretta 150 at the bottom of Hele Road to take him to dances at the Newton Abbot Community Centre just above the old Recreation Ground. He did have a brief mental illness when he was 19 which seemed to be brought on by work and family stress but he recovered at that time with treatment and plenty of support. My comments about mental health issues are purely personal observations as I am certainly no expert, and I expect on this forum we have some with a great deal of knowledge of the subject. I apologise if any of my views are wildly inaccurate. Very sad and I hope that Mike gets the help and support he clearly needs. |
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merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
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Post by merse on Oct 6, 2010 10:36:14 GMT
Although the closure of many specialist hospitals to be replaced by community based mental health and social care was described by the politicians at the time (in the 1990's) as doing away with 'Victorian asylums' so that people with mental health problems could receive 'care in the community', the specialist hospitals (such as the excellent and well respected Moorhaven Hospital just outside of Ivybridge) were not 'Victorian' in their approach and I believe they have been badly missed.
Care in the community is probably an ideal but not achievable in many situations, particularly where there is no support network of family and friends. That some psychiatric institutions still resembled "Victorian Asylums" in the 1990s was entirely down to central government, but quite frankly; most did not and some were indeed as excellent as you so rightly describe Moorhaven ~ a place I had the pleasure and privilege of visiting on a number of occasions, always linked to football ~ either playing in the South Devon League or with Torquay United as part of the "get out and about" programme we used to engage in. I remember on one significant occasion coming up against a well known Plymouth Argyle player on the football pitch who was in there due to his mental health issues. Once again the policy of evaluating public services on the basis of cost over value, and in the case of "Care in the Community" to it being derisively nick named "Don't Care about the Community" in Hackney where I used to live. Near where I now live in North London we have the magnificent paladian Friern Barnet Hospital, once the largest psychiatric institution in the country with it's 5 miles of corridors and even it's own railway station; but now the spacious and palatial home of many affluent people who have bought properties developed within it's Victorian buildings. www.princessparkmanor.net/ Another nearby is called Claybury............another magnificent cathedral to the mentally ill that the Victorians built but now again in the hands of the property developer and entrepreneur who have made huge profits from moving in the nouveau rich who enjoy wonderful views over the Thames Estuary from it's heights. Now known as Repton Park it is situated in the "Millionair's Row" of Chigwell. Just don't try and tell me that the whole financial benefit from selling off these "Victorian Asylums" was totally and adequately re-invested into "Care in the Community" |
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Post by loyalgull on Oct 6, 2010 11:38:12 GMT
just like merse and stefano i know mike poblocki very well,and we know what a talented footballer he was,and a nicer guy you would never meet.His mental and physical health have been in decline for many many years,but despite that we had a mutual mate whos wife died,it was janet duggan nee burns whom i am sure merse knew,who was there supporting the family,mike poblocki.Went off to scotland with him for a week to my mates sisters,we knew and mike knew he wasnt the full ticket but despite us trying to help him his now rock bottom standing saddens me.The evil of alcohol and mental health issues are a wicked combination,and an asbo for him will serve no purpose at all,the resulting prison sentence for breaking the terms of his asbo may well do,as his illness will rear its ugly head again.Maybe then will someone then realise the dire help he needs,but all said and done mike will have to help himself as well.Sad times for a colourful character from our distant past
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Post by aussie on Oct 6, 2010 17:13:39 GMT
All I know about him is what he gets in trouble for because he is a regular in the herald express. Would never have thought he could play footy due to the state of the bloke, quite sad really now I`ve read what you guys have written, where were his mates and family?
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Post by loyalgull on Oct 6, 2010 17:31:31 GMT
i have set the ball rolling today,regarding contact with mike and getting him the help he so obviously needs
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Post by aussie on Oct 6, 2010 17:36:14 GMT
i have set the ball rolling today,regarding contact with mike and getting him the help he so obviously needs A true champion is what you are, in every sense of the word! I`m proud to know you! |
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Post by forevertufc on Oct 6, 2010 18:52:05 GMT
I know mike poblocki very well,went to work as a fresh faced 16 year old yts lad at a plastics company in newton abbot back in 1985,thats were i met and became friends with mike.
Mike in his day was seriuosly talented footballer and an intelligent man aswell,i believe he has 7 'A' levels,though i could be wrong on that,also know his son dean very well.
Life chucked a number of cruel blow's at mike,some deal with things,mike sadly could not,already a heavy drinker,he spilt from his wife,and as his drinking got worse,turning up serveral times drunk ,he then lost his job.
Last time i saw mike it was a sad sight for any one who knew before his life went out of control,then a spoke to dean who told me he had aflat down torquay and was settled,however things seem to go wrong again after this.
anyway iam glad to see above that things are in motion to help him,as personaly iam not in a postion to do much.
and agree the asbo is just bizare,its help mike needs.
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merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
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Post by merse on Oct 6, 2010 19:23:06 GMT
i have set the ball rolling today,regarding contact with mike and getting him the help he so obviously needs PMd me tonight whilst I was out at football with Anthony and told me the detail of what he can do.........................given his (Loyalgull's) working background I'm pleased I started this thread and am also pleased with the positive response and expressions of good will shown on here since. Not an easy ask helping someone like Mike, but where there's a will there's often a way. |
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Post by lambethgull on Oct 6, 2010 22:18:43 GMT
Near where I now live in North London we have the magnificent paladian Friern Barnet Hospital, once the largest psychiatric institution in the country with it's 5 miles of corridors and even it's own railway station; but now the spacious and palatial home of many affluent people who have bought properties developed within it's Victorian buildings. www.princessparkmanor.net/[/b][/quote] 'Colney Hatch Lunatic Asylum' as it was once known was one of the largest psychiatric hospitals in Europe with 2,500 patients, a horrifying number and an indictment if any were needed on the Victorian approach to mental health. Little wonder the place resulted in the UK's worst hospital disaster when a fire killed more than 50 patients there in 1903. The notion of 'care provided in the community', is a noble aim and a worthwhile one. Pre-industrial societies don't warehouse their mentally ill, and no civilised society should either. Well-funded, well-staffed and resourced mental health units for treating those with acute mental health problems are needed, but so are the support networks and mechanisms when these people go back into the community. These unfortunately cost vast amount of money to run effectively, but even where they do exist there is no guarantee that no-one will slip through the net. |
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Post by stefano on Oct 6, 2010 22:22:59 GMT
Near where I now live in North London we have the magnificent paladian Friern Barnet Hospital, once the largest psychiatric institution in the country with it's 5 miles of corridors and even it's own railway station; but now the spacious and palatial home of many affluent people who have bought properties developed within it's Victorian buildings. www.princessparkmanor.net/[/b][/quote] 'Colney Hatch Lunatic Asylum' as it was once known was one of the largest psychiatric hospitals in Europe with 2,500 patients, a horrifying number and an indictment if any were needed on the Victorian approach to mental health. Little wonder the place resulted in the UK's worst hospital disaster when a fire killed more than 50 patients there in 1903. The notion of 'care provided in the community', is a noble aim and a worthwhile one. Pre-industrial societies don't warehouse their mentally ill, and no civilised society should either. Well-funded, well-staffed and resourced mental health units for treating those with acute mental health problems are needed, but so are the support networks and mechanisms when these people go back into the community. These unfortunately cost vast amount of money to run effectively, but even where they do exist there is no guarantee that no-one will slip through the net. [/quote] Quite right Lambeth and that is what everybody said, only not as eloquently. Nice to see you agree with everyone now  |
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Post by lambethgull on Oct 6, 2010 22:38:44 GMT
Quite right Lambeth and that is what everybody said, only not as eloquently. Nice to see you agree with everyone now On this issue it seems, but I reserve the right to be in a minority when the majority are wrong as well |
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merse
TFF member
Posts: 2,684
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Post by merse on Oct 6, 2010 22:48:47 GMT
'Colney Hatch Lunatic Asylum' as it was once known was one of the largest psychiatric hospitals in Europe with 2,500 patients, a horrifying number and an indictment if any were needed on the Victorian approach to mental health.
The notion of 'care provided in the community', is a noble aim and a worthwhile one. Pre-industrial societies don't warehouse their mentally ill, and no civilised society should either. Well-funded, well-staffed and resourced mental health units for treating those with acute mental health problems are needed, but so are the support networks and mechanisms when these people go back into the community. I wasn't pretending that Friern Barnet and Claybury were any more than magnificent buildings, and we have to recognise that mental health care was in it's infancy when they were built and far less sophisticated and developed than it it today. However, the other point I hoped to put over (and I deliberately provided the link to the sales site for "Repton Park" to do so) was to attempt to convey the absolute opulence of those buildings today compared with their shabbiness at the end of the period of use for which they were originally intended. The Victorians were living at the end of the era in which lunatic asylums had been used as places of entertainment in an attempt to fund them whereby members of the public could go along and view the unfortunate inmates rather like people visit a comedy club today. Today we are far more enlightened but in my opinion far less willing as a society to invest the huge amounts of money to care for those who need caring for than the Victorians were. Care in the Community cannot work if you deny those in it the protection of living in sheltered and properly wardened accommodation. To simply chuck those people out to the mercy of the private landlord and the cash strapped local authority and with just a centre to report to or visits from "carers" who are not on call 24/7 is totally unacceptable. I have a schizophrenic living below me, he is left to his own devices and if he "feels a bit of pressure" he is encouraged to call the authorities for help. That's fine in theory, but in reality it ain't working when the poor guy is going bonkers and playing mega loud classical music at four o'clock in the morning and the police are having to come a round to protect him from angry neighbours who have already smashed his front door in once and chucked his hi fi system off the balcony.................neighbours who we might all say should know better but who have been driven to distraction living next to a lunatic for better want of a word. A guy like that needs and deserves to be in wardened accommodation but he isn't and he isn't alone. I agree he doesn't want or need to be "warehoused" as he once would have been, but for heaven's sake what he isn't getting right now is "CARE" in the Community by any stretch of the imagination. What he is getting is the cheap option and constantly being the object of the attentions of the local police who have far more appropriate things they should be spending their time on. Well funded, well staffed and funded mental health units are what we don't have nearly enough of in this country. |
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Post by lambethgull on Oct 7, 2010 0:24:00 GMT
The irony is that institutions such as Colney Hatch were built with the purpose in mind of removing difficult individuals not just from the community, but from prisons and workhouses where they would be easier to manage; something many would consider sensible today, even if we do not agree with their methods. The Victorian era actually saw the move towards humane treatment of the mentally ill, with the use of mechanical restraint going out of fashion even if it did not go out of use. The Lunacy Act of 1845 officially recognised the status of the mentally ill as 'patients' rather than prisoners, as well as also providing for the first nation-wide regulatory framework for asylums, psychiatric hospitals and their patients, although the Madhouses Act of 1774 and 1828 (as amended) provided some protections and safeguards prior to this.
The main difficulty as I see it is that maintaining properly equipped acute Mental Health Units and proper care pathways for integrating patients back into the community comes at an enormous cost. I would agree with you that the man you describe who lives near you is not getting the support he needs, but I'm not sure where the resources are going to come from for him to get it. I am also uncomfortable with the idea that someone should be detained or supervised for long periods of time when they have committed no crime and do not represent an immediate harm to others.
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Post by loyalgull on Oct 7, 2010 8:24:01 GMT
i worked at leavesden hospital abbots langley for many years,some people in there were committed to the hospital were for such things as petty theft and teenage pregnancy.Now that is totally unacceptable,there only real issues were there borderline learning disability,which would now be supported in the community.Infact some were found to have no issues at all,but came into the system by pure accident.
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