Albert Hutchinson

I wasn't sure which thread to put this on as it involves both the Appearaces and Hutchinson threads.
Among all the discussion about who holds the record number of appearances which now seems to be agreed at Dennis Lewis 473 and Kevin Hill 474, I have heard no mention of the question of substitutes. When Lewis was playing there were no such things - he played 473 FULL games. I am in the process of compiling my spreadsheet for appearances and goals and have done the League appearances so far. This shows that Hill played in 417 league games and among these came on as substitute in 58 of them. This does not include the the number of times he was substituted himself, I am still working on that and also on similar numbers for Cup games. The number of FULL games Hill played is therefore considerably less than Lewis. Based on these figures I have problems in taking too seriously the validity of the claims on behalf of Hill as I have a feeling that a so called record was artificially created - shades of Beckham and England!
Have there been any other amendments to the statistical figures in the Centenary Book - if so where can I find them?
Thanks Jon for the all work you have done on updating the appearance statistics - I for one have appreciated it despite the rather sarcastic references you have received from other contributors to 'paint drying' and 'grass growing'!!

I agree that sub appearances should be recorded separately.

The top three in the "starts" list is Lewis, Northcott and Shaw. Add in sub appearances and Hilly goes top if you count all games, and second to Lewis in league games.

I can't begrudge Hilly the "all apppearances" record as he is such a great character - and I suppose loyalty has been a much rarer commodity in his time than in Lewis's.

Of course, Hutch would have topped every list going if it hadn't been for the War!

I've been planning to write up a list of book errors found so far, but keep geting distracted. Match 39 of 1967/68 is wrong as it shows us with ten men! I believe John Smith should be 8 not 12 and that Clarke should be 12.

I think that the appearances in the book do tie in to the grids but quite a lot of these are wrong. Some of the errors would be missing substitute appearances - Twitch should have three more appearances, but I think his starts are right.

Diffferent sources for appearance stats do tend to show varying answers. I think that the most reliable source is Barry Hugman through his "Players' Records" (last issued in 2005 I think, I've got the 1992 edition) and his annual PFA Who's Whos.

If I could get Barry's figures in electronic format, I could quickly sort and compare them for discrepancies. It would be a long and tedious manual tick and bash!

I've found another few programmes in which Albert appeared, in fact I put them up in the Programme Room a while back. I've only popped up some of the relevant pages on this thread.

The first is for the FA Cup game away to Ipswich Town in the latter's first season in the Football League, 1938 (and what a cracking programme they produced!) It includes a short biog of Albert as well which tells us he was 5ft 7" and weighed 11st 12Ibs. It also confirms that he played in every position as was the teams captain.

The second is the away game at Clapton Orient the season they played at Lea Bridge Road, 1937, before moving to Osborne Road, more commonly known as Brisbane Road, and has a small note about Albert in the 'Jottings'. Note that Les Lievesley is also shown to have played.

The third is for the game at this new venue the following year, 1938.

News of Alberts Death in 1974.

I can't name the other man or pinpoint the road in question, but please keep the photos and memorabilia coming, Derek. Fascinating stuff!

From the players' list for Torquay United in Charles Buchan’s 1931/32 News Chronicle Football Annual we find ‘Hutchinson’ along with his fellow players for that season.

Great to see Dudley's reply to Derek. Interesting to see the mention of Bert Head who we've already encountered as a Torquay United product who became better-known as a manager with clubs such as Swindon and Palace.

It's all hypothetical but as a player - just as Jon suggested with Albert himself - Bert Head might have established a fine league appearance record for the club had war not intervened. In fact, Head was one of the most durable of all our players signing in October 1936 and playing through until February 1952 when he left for Bury. You never know how things might have turned out without the war - injury or a move to a bigger club, perhaps? - but an average of thirty-five appearance per season between 1939 and 1946 would have taken Bert to around 470 league appearances. Another five seasons of Albert playing thirty-five games a year - bringing him to nearly thirty-four in 1944 - would have left him on roughly 490 appearances. Any further adjustment to the hypotheses would need to be in Head’s favour as the younger man.

As for Albert living close to the ground, that pretty much fits with our earlier discussion about where Torquay players lived in the 1930s. Plainmoor, it has been said after all, is typical football ground territory of small houses and terraced streets (in one direction anyway). Irrespective of wherever the football club may have been located, it would have been prime for the housing of footballers. And, thinking about it, the whole vicinity is relatively unaltered since Albert and Dudley’s day. Even the Daison estate – Main, First, Second and Third avenues – began to take shape in the late 1930s (time for some of the still-new houses to be bombed) and the trams would have disappeared halfway through Albert’s time at the club. Of course, throughout Albert's time at Plainmoor he could have taken a ride on the cliff railway....